What to use for ignition high HP engine???

[STREETRACE69]

I have been on here off and on. I am building a 69 Camaro with a day 2 type theme. I am trying to use mostly period correct for early 70's build. I had a NOS early style MSD that was even sealed in the box. When I hooked it up the moment I put power you actually heard a click type noise in it. I had read in Hot Rod? that they could swap the internals with a newer box. I shipped it off and they said it is not repairable and can't swap new into old box.

Engine is a 11:1 427 with approx 500 or so HP. In fully loaded street car it ran mid 12's with a HEI. I amnow running point triggered Accel distributor with old Accel super stock coil and yellow wires. It actually runs great as is but a little rich and a stumble here and there. I am not wasting anymore money on the vintage MSD deal. I have never really seen a difference with an MSD.

What is period correct? Anybody else running points and no box on a HP engine??? The points were kept as they were only trigger for MSD. DUI HEI would be quick fix but I would loose all my other parts. Any old tricks or ideas for something that works and isn't just good marketing.

Sorry for long post and this day 2 stuff is getting expensive.

[scuncio]

You could run a CD box off a stock Delco single-point distributor with a M&H hall-effect trigger conversion. Hide the CD box inside the car. The Crane box I have has a nice built-in rev limiter, no plug-in crystals like the 6AL.

[TDW]

I like the old points type stuff. In fact, I just put an old points distributor in my 500 HP 427. The only time in my life that I had to be flat-bedded home was a week ago. I had a Mallory unilite conversion in it. The junk burned up and left me stranded. I got the car home, put a real distributor and a good coil in it. Promptly went out and did some 7 grand shifts! A good set-up points system will work great for you.

[Keith Tedford]

Back in the day, I put a Delco-Remy CD ignition kit on my 427 car. Eventually it died and I went back to D112P HD Delco points in the stock distributor. When we bought our 396 car in '97, it had an HEI that eventually died. There again I went back to HD points in a good Delco distributor and the car starts and runs fine. Blue Streak make good HD points as well. The points system provided plenty of spark for the L72 and L78 and these engines aren't shy on rpm potential either. I've never seen any reason to go to anything else.

[PxTx]

Can you post a pic of the old MSD box?

I firmly beleive a CD box will bring out the best on your motor. I am also surprised that you've never seen a differnce with an MSD box. It's a shame the old one got aced.

If you are making 500 hp, right not I'd say yo are doing pretty well. Do you want/ expect more HP or are you looking for improved driveability?

[RPOLS3]

Hope I'm not hi-jacking this thread but what's everyone's opinions on the electronic points conversion kits such as those sold by Pertronix or Lectric Limited for those that want the stock look?

Jake

[STREETRACE69]

I am not great at posting pics but someone had posted for me in the day 2 thread a while back. When the car ran in the 12's it had a different ignition set up. I was also thinking of hiding in MSD box or some other clever idea. I might even open it up to see if a newer would fit as if they did it in the magazine article maybe they (MSD) just don't want to get involved anymore and it really does fit. It should be back here any day.

I have everything wired up and holes drilled in detailed done engine compartment so I am kind of stuck with it either as just a decoration that would look cool or with some sort of hidden set up.

As far as a difference with MSD? No, I do not get the hype. Magazine articles have also proven maybe at best 1-3 hp gain. On a all out car with hotter boxes I am sure there is more there and the added features make them worth it but on a street car?? DUI HEI is the best bang for the buck. I have put them on cars and the difference is there you don't have to convince yourself you feel something. I was even looking at there smaller set up as it might look period correct.

Looking to smooth and stable idle and clean it up a bit.

[PxTx]

I've got the most experience wiht MSD, but my expectations would be the same for all CD ignition boxes.

The first noticeable improvment is usually just what you want. Smoother and stable idle. The CD systems lower COV (coefficient of varioation)and as an additional benefit plugs don't foul as quickly.

Improved HP may only be a few on the top end, but I bet the whole curve is up a few hp in reality. I also think in the upper R's the CD does a better job of lighting all of the fuel. Just bolting an MSD on without an ignition re-tune may also lead to underwelming results.

I think you are right that the old MSD box could probably take the new parts, but they don't want to invest the labor. You are more motivated to make it work. MSD now has the stuff already potred in the boxes and coming from China. If they were still making them the old way, they could re-use your housing no-problem. I look forward to seeing your results!

[beater68427]

I would just get a new MSD box and drill the rivets and install the new unit with the old box top, Years ago when Jeff Gaul was still alive I had done some magazine articles for them and at that time all MFG was done in Mexico beeing in El paso it was easy importing and dealing with the plant. For them to do it would not happen just not cost effective.

[markjohnson]

As stated above by PXTX, an MSD 6 Ignition is mainly for a smooth and stable idle and helps prevent plug fouling at low RPM driving.......especially from overly rich, out-of-the-box Holley's. The Mulitple Spark Discharge feature kinda goes away over 4000 RPM and there's only time for one good, solid spark. By the way, the MSD 6 box was designed in the early 70's and has some REALLY outdated electronics inside of it. The newer MSD6 Digital Box is vastly superior with modern components and is only slightly more money. It's kinda like comparing a 1970's desk-top computer to a modern, new lap-top! Anyway, I've gotta admit that I'm also a big fan of the GM Performance Parts HO HEI Distributor. It is a complete unit that comes standard with ZZ4's and 502's that has a very nice advance curve already built into it. I always keep one around and have run mid-11's while spinning it up to 6500 with great reliability.