which is best- c.e. or date correct motor?

[L34Pace]

[/ QUOTE ] So my take on that is if you have a CE motor dated for the car you gain 38 points over a decked block thats dated for the car ,because the CE has broach marks..A never stamped block would be even better but harder to find for sure

[/ QUOTE ]

The block casting, (350 pts) would be judged first and then the date, (175 pts) and finally the pad with its three elements. Keep in mind that the stops are put in place at the first non comforming data. In the case of a legitimate CE that would be extremely prohibitive unless you used a CE from another vehicle

[427king]

I think Alans orignal question was which of the 2[CE versus decked and dated]made a car worth more. And i believe the answer given those choices is CE. CEs could certainly be dated before the car date. The one thing i disagree on[ok theres more than one !!!] is that if i had a valid CE motor in a corvette id have to take a CE from someone elses car to get more points if there block was dated earlier than my car and the legit CE in my corvette was not. makes no sense.

[Verne_Frantz]

Exactly when did Chevy first start producing "CE" coded replacement engine assemblies?
I've seen replacements from the early '60s with "XX" suffixes and no sequential number.

Verne

[Zedder]

The distinction is really pretty simple...judging compares the car to "as delivered" condition. Since the CE replacement motor would come after delivery, it is not desirable for judging purposes. Those looking to preserve the "history" of a car, would likely prefer a CE block if there was paperwork supporting the warranty work. Personally, since I prefer the "as delivered" category, I would pay more for a properly done "restoration" motor if my original was long gone. It's all a mater of personal preference. Having the correct motor from another car is still not the original to me, so it has no more value than a correctly dated resto motor.

[JoeG]

What would be the definition of a properly done restoration motor................

[Zedder]

One that would get full points in NCRS-type judging - dated, numbered, broach marks etc.

[Verne_Frantz]

[ QUOTE ]
One that would get full points in NCRS-type judging - dated, numbered, broach marks etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

Zedder, I respectfully disagree with your answer to JoeG. Just because an engine can win the most points at an NCRS event does NOT mean it's a properly done "restoration" motor. A car that scores a PERFECT score at an NCRS national event is not necessarilly the most historically ACCURATE restoration of that car. It only means that the car was done to NCRS guidlines.

I guess my overall point is that any car deserves to be restored to it's former original condition, just for it's own sake, and to preserve a piece of history for other people to learn from long after we're all long gone. As time passes and we learn more, I hope more people realize that a "restoration" should be a depiction of a car just as it was originally built. If changes are made to a car during restoration that deviate from the way it was delivered new, just because someone wrote a guideline about how it "should" be done, then the purpose of the restoration was to win a $10. trophy (or claim the status from the award to gain more money) rather than to accurately preserve the history of the car.

The CAR is the MOST important thing. The most important thing is NOT winning an award or increasing the car's value. I guess I'm just living in a idealistic world......I can't help my views. No offense meant.
I would rather leave off a $10. item from a car I restored exactly as original and sacrifice the peddigre of a national award and the $10K+ more it would be worth if restored to someone's guideline for the sake of restoring it exactly as original.

I guess preserving history happens to be more important to me than changing something for the sake of a short term personal gain during our little speck in history.

Verne

[L34Pace]

I agree with Zedder in that the judging criteria is "as delivered" in the current format. The only difference I see that is not addressed in judging between restoration engines and GM warranty replacements is that the CE was a GM program with a documented proceedure for installation at authorized GM service locations. Restoration engines are individual modifications. Paperwork supporting the warranty exchange should carry the same judging value as that of the "as delivered" paper documentation. Afterall, the window sticker and POP warranty booklet were a component of an "as delivered" vehicle. Ironic that we covet the POP as a documentation tool but dont acknowledge the details spelled out between its covers. Like it or not its part of the GM package.