Dissing the YENKO!!

[toner]

A 69 camaro will ALWAYS look better just sitting still, let alone what it's capable of doing by a qualified driver. The ricers will never come close to the style of any muscle car.
[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/burnout.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif[/img]

toner

[DjD]

Just some general comments... First Camaro supercars were designed for straight line. It's kinda hard to bitch about a car's cornering and braking when it wasn't designed to compete in the corners. Maybe Charlie needs to take that writer for a ride in the Mule or we need to find a vintage trans-am camaro for a test drive...

As for little engines doing more, in some respects they do but then compared to a 427 LS6 SBC do they really? My next point is weight to HP ratio. I've no math to back this but let's use Charlie a bit more since he's out having fun!! Drop the mill from a hi performance streetable import between the fenders of the Mule and see how it does...

I do think the artical was written for a target audiance and the writer was saying "the old cars are ok guys" but like so many in todays world the writer had to pick apart the Camaro to help afirm himself with the readers... [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/[/img]

[JoeG]

MOMS -- APPLE PIE --- AND ---CHEVROLET [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif[/img]

[whitetop]

Everyone needs to read the letters in the July Hot Rod mag about the future of the hobby and what is going to be popular in the future. The basic gist of the letters was the animosity the traditional guys have toward tuner cars the import guys also have toward the "old stuff". Tuners look upon carbs as ancient technology and have no interest. What I noticed at Carlisle Ford show this past weekend: Sitting behind 65-73 Mustangs, Ford Fairlanes and Galaxies was grey haired old men. Sitting behind the new Mustangs, Ford Focus, lowered trucks were young men. Not always the case but pretty much drawn across age lines.
I have never believed the argument that the younger generation cannot afford to buy older muscle cars so they buy sport compacts. Most of the "tuner" cars at the show probably had as much or more money in them than most of the traditional muscle cars present.

[tom406]

The same magazine (July '03 HOT ROD) has a great editorial by my favorite automotive editor, David Freiburger. He points out how, since the dawn of automotive tuning, people have fostered these divisions within the hobby. The Model A 4-banger tuners didn't think the flatheads were "hot rods", then the flathead guys didn't think the overhead valve cars were real "hot rods", then the overhead valve guys didn't think the factory musclecars were "hot rods", because any fool could go buy one, and that was a corruption of the hobby.

The language of the Sport Compact writer sounds about on par with how CAR CRAFT writes about the "ricers". Good natured or not, I don't appreciate the negative vibe from either camp. The hobby needs more cooperation to grow and defend itself from misguided regulations.

There's a new rush of people into the sport compact hobby, and most of them don't have "car crazy" parents or anything, so they're figuring it out as they go. Bolting stuff onto a late model is a lot less intimidating than restoring an old car. And for a 19 year old kid to try and find a real insurance policy on a 30 year old car (not just liability), particularly if their parents aren't willing to title it in their name and do some smoke and mirror job on who's the primary driver, is just about impossible. Hell, its tough for me, a 33 year old father of two, to get a regular primary policy on my old stuff, during the times when I'm "between" late model daily drivers.

The division isn't always money or age, its often experience. Some of the young guys will broaden their taste and do other cars. Many will leave the hobby in their mid-20's, like people always have. I try to be an ambassador for the old car hobby. In my time at the dealerships, several times we've sold an old musclecar to a young guy who drove up in a tweaked Honda. It's cool. The street rod and musclecar hobbies have enough cranky old farts, I encourage everyone I meet to try the wise old mentor thing instead.


Here's some common ground that everyone could appreciate. In AUTOWEEK a couple weeks ago, there was an article on a shop in Michigan that was doing Ford Focus SVT conversions. They were putting tweaked 400+HP Cobra Mustang supercharged 4.6 V8's into them and driving them through the REAR wheels, all without cutting the hood or floor. Looked factory and carried a warranty. Struck me as the true modern successor to the Yenko Nova [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/burnout.gif[/img]. It also cost $69K plus your Focus. (Clill, did you order one yet?)

[JoeG]

Old FARTS + New Farts = Hobby Survival. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beers.gif[/img]

[69RSZ]

i went to a benifit car show in my area and i enterd both my 69 rs z/28 and my 2002 35th anniversary perf. edition car,the one thing i noticed was that the younger crowd liked the 02 camaro and to my surprise some of them knew that it was a GMMG car,while the older crowd walked right by the 02 and stopped to look at the 69 not even takeing a glance at the new car sitting beside it (the 02).the younger kids like the newer cars like we did when uh we were young [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img].did anyone ever take 2 cars to a show, one old and one new and watch what car draws the most attention?

Ron C
69 rsz
02 35th perf edition #11
71 ss 454 chevelle

[CWilliams]

Good point 69RSZ. This past weekend my Brother and I went to cruise in. I drove my '01 phaseII Berger, he drove his '39 Ford coupe with a SBC engine with a Chevy manual tranny. His car is all steel, the paint is original black and all pretty much gone, kinda looks like "stove black", his interior is completely shot. It runs strong and can wickedly burn the tires. We parked next to each other, when he proped opened his hood with a broom stick, people came in flocks (engine is a nice crate motor). His car looks like the old jalopy race cars. Only one young kid in the crowd knew what a "Berger" camaro was, my car got several observations and I got several questions, but I think it was largely due to his car being next to mine and drawing the crowd, 90% of the people their were from the 50's or so. Once they knew the story behind my car they were all into it, I don't think they'd have cared much for a dealer built ricer though!.

[68z302]

I have to agree with you whitetop.
It's the next Generation interested in different cars.
My daughters boyfriend gets a laugh when I bring home things for my Camaro. I just bought NOS points & condenser from a swapmeet and when he saw them he cracked up!
[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/haha.gif[/img]
He's got an '86 Dodge "Shelby" Charger with a turbo.
He stepped up from a Turbo I to a Turbo II & added a big Volvo intercooler. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img]
It's actually kind of neat. Black with a silver sripe. Factory Alloys with 50 series tires and lowered a bit.
And it has CS embroidered into the seats. (Future Colectable?)
He hates ricers too. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]
At least he's driving North American Iron! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif[/img][img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif[/img]

[Stefano]

There is an article in the latest(July '03) 'Motor Trend' which includes all three cars as well.