1965 Chevelle 300, 396/425 M22 COPO

[fsc66]

Interesting as Charlie stated the IY block is mentioned ion page 41 and the entry shows it as a 396/375 HP not a 396/425 Motor as indicated with the car. Wonder if that was an error on Alan’s part or the motor is really a 396/375 HP engine???

Paul

[JoeC]

There were always a lot of unanswered questions on documenting this car such as if there were any pictures of the car when new or when it was bought by the second owner. What engine was in it , where is the original engine, was it a race car, etc.

This is the first time I have seen the trim tag and it is very interesting.

I have been researching/collecting trim tags for many years for cars and trucks that were Yenko, special order, F&SO, COPO, Police, Fire, Military, export, etc.

It is interesting to compare the special tags to the normal production tag.

There can be tell-tale signs such as found on some 67 Yenko , 68 COPO Camaros, and Yenko/COPO Chevelles.

I'm not an expert on 65 Chevelles but looking at the trim tag from this car it does appear to be some kind of special order.

The Kansas 1965 Chevelle trim tag used the Group 1, 2,3,4,5 system and this car has a 5F169C. I can't find the decode for the 5F169C but the long number/letter code looks similar to what I have seen on other special order trim tags.

The Chevelle Stuff site has a bunch of 65 Chevelle trim tags to compare including Z-16 which has a 5Y for custom delux rear seat belts , there is a 5, 5W, 5O but no 5F.

http://chevellestuff.net/1965/chevel...s/65-kan-2.htm

[JoeC]

here is the Z-16 prototype

https://www.mecum.com/lots/SC0509-79...evelle-ss-z16/

[fsc66]

I asked Jeff Helms about the IY code listed in Alan Colvin's book and why it listed the engine as a 396/375 HP motor.
From Jeff: "When Alan wrote the book he did not have the COPO sheets from Tonawanda yet that explained the engine was a 396/425 and how to build it, so it remains correct as a 396/425 motor. Someone out there has the specifics on the COPO build, I'm sure we'd all love to see
Also, perhaps someone has information on the engine past number listed; 3888819 or the other COPO motor listed above this one, COPO 9557: 3882847?
Paul

[markjohnson]

That 327 COPO 9557 caught my eye on the sheet also. There have always been rumors of 1964 327-365 solid lifter Chevelles and maybe that carried over into a few rare 1965’s because other than a Fuelie (I REALLY doubt that happened) I don’t know what else it could possibly be.

[jeffschevelle]

I've been posting for years that the car is legit every time it comes up in a thread. Glad it finally was restored and made available for all to see. And very glad Mr. Mattison was able to provide that engine code list, further verifying it.

Mark Meekins showed me pictures of this car 20 or so years ago, that he had taken in the 90's. It was still wearing its original paint (which was the case all the way up until the recent restoration). There was no sign of any lettering ever being on it. At that time it still had (and now still has) a convertible boxed frame with the partial VIN on it, and many Z16-specific parts including steering column, radiator, sway bars, springs, front 11" brakes and spindles, and special riveted wheels (including the original spare which still has its CORRECT square-edged Firestone Super Sports 7.74x14 gold line tire, not the earlier pie crust version that is sold by Coker). The car also had the mag caps in those old pictures.

Mark had pics of the window sticker too. Although it is different in some respects from a KC regular production w/s (as it was probably printed or typed in the Central Office along with the work orders for the various components of the car), it is real too. The COPO number is on it, and those pics were taken years before Mr. Mattison unearthed any of the documentation bearing that COPO number. So unless someone was psychic, the w/s is real.

As to the HP, it was definitely a 425. The Tonawanda work order (or whatever they called it) calls out to build a 65 full size L78/K66 (396/425 with transistor ignition) engine with 3 modifications - (1) substitute LH L37 (which is the Z16 engine RPO) exhaust manifold in place of LH L78 exhaust manifold, (2) substitute RH L37 exhaust manifold in place of RH L78 exhaust manifold, and (3) substitute an L37 oil pan in place of L78 passenger car oil pan. (All those items are identified by part numbers, and the part numbers tie back to the descriptions above.)

That also confirms that the car would have come with orange valve covers, not chrome Z16 covers. If they had been chrome, that would have been listed as an additional substitution.

Given the big front brakes, the original rear axle would have been built in a Z16 housing with big brakes too. I don't know how to verify what the original gear ratio was, unless the current owner was told what it was by his cousin who ordered the car new. But either way, in light of the other purpose-built specs of the car, no doubt it was a posi, and it was probably the lowest gearset that was available at the axle plant for a Chevy 12-bolt at that time. The original axle was replaced as part of the Olds drivetrain swap back when the car was still fairly new, but an accurate appearing clone axle is in it now.

Another extremely interesting tidbit, that has nothing to do with the performance aspects of the car but shows just how specific the original owner was about what he wanted on his new car -- This car never had the bright rocker panel moldings that were standard on all regular production 65 300 sedans. Again, the car still had original paint before the resto, and there were never any holes drilled for any molding attaching clips. Makes you wonder why he wanted the mag caps rather than dog-dishes, but to each his own!

[Fast67VelleN2O]

Here is a screenshot from a Facebook discussion on the car. Straight from the horses mouth. Still not sure why all these original parts are not reunited with a rare car like this? If Alan Colvin knows where the original rear axle for this car is, we should know what ratio it is.

[WILMASBOYL78]

Originally Posted by JoeC

here is the Z-16 prototype

https://www.mecum.com/lots/SC0509-79...evelle-ss-z16/

..

They refer to the engine as an L-78...but that is not correct, shouldn't it be L-37.

This is an interesting thread...never knew about this car until now.

-wilma

[Astock]

The original owner knew what he was doing, or knew people that did.

[Mr70]

I remember talking to Mark @ the NCOA Showdown about this car.He showed me pictures he took and said how much he wanted to own it,but it couldn't be bought.I didn't want town it,but asked where the original engine was,and he said he's not going to say.
I assume he either didn't know @ that time,or did know and was trying to acquire it.
Glad to see this all come to light now.