Reproduction Documentation - Page 3

JAD · #21 05-04-2009, 05:13 AM

I have heard the paper and ink can be tested by a forensic lab that specializes in documents.They can then give you an approximate age of both.I think most major cities would have someone who does this.

Tommy_Mathison · #22 05-04-2009, 05:22 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I have heard the paper and ink can be tested by a forensic lab that specializes in documents.They can then give you an approximate age of both.I think most major cities would have someone who does this.

[/ QUOTE ]

The draw back of carbon dating is that it requires a piece of what is being tested to be destroyed.

**CamaroNOS** · #23 05-04-2009, 05:50 AM

Wow, I never thought about planting bogus previous owners with phone numbers and a pretty little story to go with them in order to sell a high priced car. If that is the case, you could always ask them to put their history on a piece of paper and get it notarized by a neutral party lawyer. This should bluff out even the best poker players and most likely make them run for the hills.

Anything and everything is possible. It is kind of sad to say the least.

I guess we are spoiled up here in Ontario. When you sell a car, the Ministry of Transportation (your equiveleant of the D.O.T.) issues the seller a printed Sellers Kit that serves two real purposes. One is it documents if the vehicle has any liens against it but more importantly for research purposes, it docuemts all of the previous owners of that vehicle from 1973. This ownership documentation cannot be altered. It is based on the ownership history from 1973, kept by the M.T.O. It should be mentioned that a prospective buyer can also request this package as well.

For the members information, anybody/anywhere can request this information from the Ontario Ministry of Transportation for any car that was owned by a private owner or business in the province of Ontario. The cost is ONLY $20. Could be the best twenty bucks you have ever spent!

If wanted, I could supply the contact information. Once again, this list of previous owners could be the breaking straw for a lot of deals, both past and present.

It is pretty much fool proof.

Regards

old5.0 · #24 05-04-2009, 04:05 PM

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My point is owner history will be faked next, or maybe has already. Fake docs, fake paper trail, leads to 2 or 3 accomplices with phone calls, photos, and stories and more fake ownership papers. Could this happen?

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Hadn't thought of that, but yeah, why not? With some of these cars bringing six and even seven figures, the crooks will get more and more creative, and willing to take bigger and bigger risks.

69L72RS · #25 05-04-2009, 04:33 PM

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The draw back of carbon dating is that it requires a piece of what is being tested to be destroyed.

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There are a few ways, besides carbon dating, that documents can be dated without destoying them.

old5.0 · #26 05-04-2009, 04:44 PM

I did a quick search related to vintage blank paper, and got several pages of hits. I didn't see anything that looked like buildsheet blanks or anything, but I'm not a paper expert. I also only spent about 2 minutes looking.

**BARN FIND** · #27 05-04-2009, 04:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Wow, I never thought about planting bogus previous owners with phone numbers and a pretty little story to go with them in order to sell a high priced car. If that is the case, you could always ask them to put their history on a piece of paper and get it notarized by a neutral party lawyer. This should bluff out even the best poker players and most likely make them run for the hills.

Regards

[/ QUOTE ]

You are thinking like an honest person. First of all, about all a notary does is say " this person is in fact the person who is signing this document" and second of all for this much money a crook will be a... crook!!!
Also in many states a Notary does not have to have any legal background. So if a car is presented to you with a ton of already notarized documnetation are you going to ask for it to be notarized again.

**PeteLeathersac** · #28 05-04-2009, 05:07 PM

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Found out he's the guy that is selling on eBay. Seller ID vin-number-aged

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Do you mean it is Brian Mallyon from Calgary Canada?.

Couple more things if this is the guy...

I believe Brian Mallyon is an NCRS Member in good standing..

I looked at some of his auction history a few years back and included was his purchasing of old paper w/ correct water marks etc..

Lots of great comments here as usual but what can we do?.

~ Pete

Shevelle · #29 05-04-2009, 05:20 PM

No, Pete. I meant that the guy with the Craigslist ads is the guy on eBay with the user ID vin-number-aged. We sent him an email pretending to be interested and he indicated he was located in Florida. He has many auctions running on Ebay currently:
vin-number-aged

**bashton** · #30 05-04-2009, 05:37 PM

What is as scary as this guys obvious intent to assist in defrauding people, is reading his eBay feedback showing how happy his customers are with his product, and knowing what may happen afterwords.

Oh yeah...created just as a "Novelty for show only,NOT OFFICIAL".

Sorry to rant...this just hits a nerve with me.

Bashton
MCACN Managing Member

Dedicated to the Promotion and Preservation of American Muscle Cars, Dealer built Supercars and COPO cars.