Restamping blocks??????????????

[Salvatore]

I don't know Bruce, Should they lower the standards?
Is it that important for people to get "gold"?
Its either original, born with or not.

Very hard!!! to find true, all original, assembly line cars with all their limbs intacted.
Makes those cars worth that much more.

[bergy]

I could look at it either way Sammy. There's a Pace Car on eBay with factory engine, trans, and rear. It's pretty clear that if/when restored it won't have any original sheet metal on it - none. So, will that car (when restored) be more "original" then an original sheet metal car with original engine & rear, but replacement trans? I'd pay more for the original sheet metal car sans original trans. JMHO - I'd also say that the original sheet metal car in this example is more deserving of Gold.

[bashton]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bergy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mr 707</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The ncrs in my opinion got really soft in the early 90s. all those fake trim tags(( about 1990)) were showing up because buyers wanted desireable colors and they were passing them with flying colors. Reds and blacks started showing up like crazy at every show. The block stamping really showed up in 1989 in corvettes when a magazine article came out for the 435 to go to 100,000. </div></div>

NCRS has gotten really good at picking out these old fake tags at the national level. Cars show up...they take picture of tags....go to the computer for comparison....come back out on the field and tell the entrant that they are sorry that they can't judge his/her car. Also, their pad stamp data base is huge. Partial points credit for correct part numbers and cast dates has been a good thing. IMO - MCACN judging should adopt partial points in all classes for correct part numbers and cast dates - lets a lot more people try for gold. It's no secret on this site that very few muscle cars have all 3 original drive train components. </div></div>

Bergy, that has been our policy since inception. We also do not judge any cars that we find to have reproduction tags under any circumstances.

Your point is also why we offer Day2 Concours judging, which allows <span style="font-style: italic">period correct</span> but non numbers matching
parts, which to date I believe is a MCACN exclusive.

Bashton

[bashton]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: [email protected]</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't know Bruce, Should they lower the standards?
Is it that important for people to get &quot;gold&quot;?
Its either original, born with or not.

Very hard!!! to find true, all original, assembly line cars with all their limbs intacted.
Makes those cars worth that much more. </div></div>

In our opinion, absolutely not. We would rather be known as the &quot;tough&quot; guys than the ones that hand out awards for sub-par cars.

Bashton

[Salvatore]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bergy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I could look at it either way Sammy. There's a Pace Car on eBay with factory engine, trans, and rear. It's pretty clear that if/when restored it won't have any original sheet metal on it - none. So, will that car (when restored) be more &quot;original&quot; then an original sheet metal car with original engine &amp; rear, but replacement trans? I'd pay more for the original sheet metal car sans original trans. JMHO - I'd also say that the original sheet metal car in this example is more deserving of Gold.</div></div>

I had this discussion years back with I think Marlin about that. I am more in favor if something has to be original let it be sheetmetal, subframe, interior and things that you can see.
My Z/28 has a correct dated replacement motor. I would rather have that then a rebodied car with
born with&quot; drive train and maybe just the cowl tag if I had to make a choice.

[Verne_Frantz]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bashton</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: [email protected]</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't know Bruce, Should they lower the standards?
Is it that important for people to get &quot;gold&quot;?
Its either original, born with or not.

Very hard!!! to find true, all original, assembly line cars with all their limbs intacted.
Makes those cars worth that much more. </div></div>

In our opinion, absolutely not. We would rather be known as the &quot;tough&quot; guys than the ones that hand out awards for sub-par cars.

Bashton </div></div>

You're doing it the right way Bob. Lowering the standards will make a lot of people happier for a while but soon after the value of the award will be meaningless. Organizations that just want everyone to go home with a trophy should just put one in each goodie bag.

Verne [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/flag.gif[/img]

[kwhizz]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: [email protected]</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bergy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I could look at it either way Sammy. There's a Pace Car on eBay with factory engine, trans, and rear. It's pretty clear that if/when restored it won't have any original sheet metal on it - none. So, will that car (when restored) be more &quot;original&quot; then an original sheet metal car with original engine &amp; rear, but replacement trans? I'd pay more for the original sheet metal car sans original trans. JMHO - I'd also say that the original sheet metal car in this example is more deserving of Gold.</div></div>

I had this discussion years back with I think Marlin about that. I am more in favor if something has to be original let it be sheetmetal, subframe, interior and things that you can see.
My Z/28 has a correct dated replacement motor. I would rather have that then a rebodied car with
born with&quot; drive train and maybe just the cowl tag if I had to make a choice. </div></div>


Sammy........Send that &quot;Beater&quot; here to the Midwest and we will LS it so you can drive it......LOL

[bergy]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: [email protected]</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bergy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I could look at it either way Sammy. There's a Pace Car on eBay with factory engine, trans, and rear. It's pretty clear that if/when restored it won't have any original sheet metal on it - none. So, will that car (when restored) be more &quot;original&quot; then an original sheet metal car with original engine &amp; rear, but replacement trans? I'd pay more for the original sheet metal car sans original trans. JMHO - I'd also say that the original sheet metal car in this example is more deserving of Gold.</div></div>

I had this discussion years back with I think Marlin about that. I am more in favor if something has to be original let it be sheetmetal, subframe, interior and things that you can see.
My Z/28 has a correct dated replacement motor. I would rather have that then a rebodied car with
born with&quot; drive train and maybe just the cowl tag if I had to make a choice. </div></div>

I agree completely Sam. It's obviously a subject with differing opinions though! I'm certainly not being critical of the judging standards - hats off to the guys who dedicate their time &amp; talent to the effort!

[70 copo]

If you cannot beat them, provide incentive to declare....

http://www.bloomingtongold.com/image...elines2015.pdf

[ANDY M]

Phil, is this why the abbreviation &quot;NOM&quot; has been changed to mean &quot;NEW ORIGINAL MOTOR&quot;? [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/dunno.gif[/img] [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/hmmm.gif[/img]