$5 Million Dollar HEMI CUDA Convertible!!

[mrriggsohara]

Charlie,

Does that Woodland in your address stand for Woodland Hills in the San Fernando Valley?

Regarding the guy who owns Steve's old 71 Hemi Cuda not having any desire to own that 4 door: I certainly don't hold that against him. I appreciate his taste, too.

But let me say this: When a guy says he wouldn't even pay $30K for the rarest hemi car in the world, it sounds like he is just being nasty. Any one who owns, collects, or merely knows about hemi cars knows that the parts in that 4 door alone are worth much more than $30K. Right??? Perfectly restored parts cost a fortune these days. Even crappy original parts cost a lot of money. Restoring crappy old original parts costs a fortune, too. So, what is this guy really talking about? Fine, he doesn't desire the car, but it sounds like we're getting back to insulting other hobbiests.

[442w30]

The red Chevy is actually a Bel Air or Biscayne, if memory serves correct. It was in a feature with a similar (albeit 2-door) '69 car in black.

[442w30]

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We shall see what the 4-door hemi car brings at the randworkman auction.

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I will have to respectfully disagree. We know from eBay and B-J that auctions don't determine a car's worth; all it determines is what a buyer is willing to pay. A 4-door Hemi is not worth more than a ragtop or even a Coronet 500 hardtop in the general market. This car will be attractive to those who like something unusual. If it goes for something high (and you must be joking when you talk about "2 million") it'll be an anomoly and not its fair market value.

Regarding fine art . . . it's not a good comparison. Art is universal. Musclecars are cultural. Who likes musclecars? Americans and Canadians, people from Oz, some from Scandinavia, a few from the UK, and that's about it. Sure, the supply of Hemicuda ragtops outstrips supply, and that's why they're going for so much. But do you really think they can be equated to fine art? Sorry, but I'll take 10 gullwings before I pay that much for a Mopar with the build quality of a Yugo.

[njsteve]

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We shall see what the 4-door hemi car brings at the randworkman auction.

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Regarding fine art . . . it's not a good comparison. Art is universal. Musclecars are cultural. Who likes musclecars? Americans and Canadians, people from Oz, some from Scandinavia, a few from the UK, and that's about it. Sure, the supply of Hemicuda ragtops outstrips supply, and that's why they're going for so much. But do you really think they can be equated to fine art? Sorry, but I'll take 10 gullwings before I pay that much for a Mopar with the build quality of a Yugo.

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You cant really compare art to musclecars. Art is an expression of creativity by one person, that is then valued by others, usually long after the artist is dead. Musclecars were assembly line, manufactured pieces of machinery that are worth more in an intrinsic fashion as some type of time machine that takes the owner back to his or her childhood days. That is one of the reason that these cars may eventually drop in value once the era of these owners die off. You can use the example of brass-era cars, Models Ts and the like. There is really no one around (alive) who remembers them, so there is no linkage to the past creating an emotional tie to the car.

-Sort of a Darwinian view of things

One of the cars sitting in my garage is my late Grandmother's 75 Firebird Esprit. Not really worth anything in terms of market value, but when I take it out on the road with my kids in the car with me, they are actually driving in their Great-Grandmother's car. That is just mind boggling. My Great Grandmother's "car" would have been a horse and buggy back in Belarus

[SamLBInj]

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We shall see what the 4-door hemi car brings at the randworkman auction.

[/ QUOTE ]

Regarding fine art . . . it's not a good comparison. Art is universal. Musclecars are cultural. Who likes musclecars? Americans and Canadians, people from Oz, some from Scandinavia, a few from the UK, and that's about it. Sure, the supply of Hemicuda ragtops outstrips supply, and that's why they're going for so much. But do you really think they can be equated to fine art? Sorry, but I'll take 10 gullwings before I pay that much for a Mopar with the build quality of a Yugo.

[/ QUOTE ]

You cant really compare art to musclecars. Art is an expression of creativity by one person, that is then valued by others, usually long after the artist is dead. Musclecars were assembly line, manufactured pieces of machinery that are worth more in an intrinsic fashion as some type of time machine that takes the owner back to his or her childhood days. That is one of the reason that these cars may eventually drop in value once the era of these owners die off. You can use the example of brass-era cars, Models Ts and the like. There is really no one around (alive) who remembers them, so there is no linkage to the past creating an emotional tie to the car.

-Sort of a Darwinian view of things

One of the cars sitting in my garage is my late Grandmother's 75 Firebird Esprit. Not really worth anything in terms of market value, but when I take it out on the road with my kids in the car with me, they are actually driving in their Great-Grandmother's car. That is just mind boggling. My Great Grandmother's "car" would have been a horse and buggy back in Belarus

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Maybe, Maybe not, look at the wide world of Harley Davidson. If something is good, its usually good for a lond time..Model A?, what was so special about it, Remember, back then it was just transportation, Our era was fun

[Charley Lillard]

Riggs.... Woodland is North near Sacramento.
My Friend is not trying to be nasty. He has no use for that car. He also is not into buying cars for parts so parting out the sum of it's parts because they might total more than 30K has no appeal to him either. How many parts off a 4 door are usable on another car anyway ? I just watched a 2 door Hemi car sell at Russo and Steel for about 65K and I would take that 2 door over that 4 door every time. We all know it will bid to more than 30K. I came to that # by removing 0's from anothers comment.

[Charley Lillard]

Riggs..Same friend also has a 70 Hemi Cuda convert and the other Hemi Coronet convert. So he does like Mopars and variety.

[mrriggsohara]

There is wisdom in your words.

"We know from eBay and B-J that auctions don't determine a car's worth; all it determines is what a buyer is willing to pay. A 4-door Hemi is not worth more than a ragtop or even a Coronet 500 hardtop in the general market. This car will be attractive to those who like something unusual. If it goes for something high (and you must be joking when you talk about "2 million") it'll be an anomoly and not its fair market value."

You hit the nail on the head: 1) Sales determine only what a buyer is willing to pay; 2) the car will be attractive to those who like something unusual; 3) an anomoly exists when any hemi car goes for more than $1 million, let alone an ugly 4-door car most apparently wouldn't want to be caught dead in.

I know for a fact that the woner of the 4 door car was offered $1 million dollars for the same car almost 10 years ago. Like many who own what they cannot replace, inmost cases, hold the objects more dear than the almighty dollar. The guy who owns the 4-door car now owns two of the 4. According to what I have read, that is the only reason he is willing to part with 1. When he was offered $1 million for his car, not a single 1971 hemi cuda had yet sold for such an amount.

Look. I remeber when Mark McGuire was getting close to breaking the home run record. He was quoted as saying he, "wouldn't pay $10 for the ball that breaks the record. The ball isn't worth 10 dollars." Of course I felt he was out of line to make such a statement in light of all the baseball memorabilia in today's market. But we let him live. And when the ball or balls were hit over the fence and gathered up, eventually they sold for millions.

Not everyone can understand what's in the minds of collectors. But I still hope the 71 hewmi cuda guy and the 4-door guy get all of the money they hope to get. Obviously someone out there has the money to spend at the blink of an eye, and if that money helps a guy do better things for himself and his family, I think it makes the world a better place. Spread the wealth a little bit.

[12bolt]

Not everyone can understand what's in the minds of collectors. But I still hope the 71 hewmi cuda guy and the 4-door guy get all of the money they hope to get. Obviously someone out there has the money to spend at the blink of an eye, and if that money helps a guy do better things for himself and his family, I think it makes the world a better place. Spread the wealth a little bit.

[/ QUOTE ] "Riggs" Old boy, you speak with Reserved Intelligence. You handled all Banter thrown your way with eloquence not often seen in an Internet chatroom. I hope to meet you at the Auction as well as any other Forum members who will be in attendance. I am the Guy with a lot of Tattoos and the White COPO Camaro that will be crossing the Block at that Sale.

[mrriggsohara]

Charley (sorry I misspelled your name last time),

You asked, "How many parts off a 4 door are usable on another car?" Answer: All of the drivetrain. Basically everything except some interior and some mouldings.

I would not have guessed nor ever suggested that your friend who owns one of the most valuable muscle cars in the world would be motivated by a deal he could make that would get him a few bucks profit after dealing with selling parts. But I did think there was a strong likelihood he might endulge in restoration projects of his own, which would make all of the above parts useful to him on any 1966 car built around the same time.

In fact I am looking for a perfectly restored 1966 hemi car for this very purpose. I have spent ridiculous amounts of money restoring old parts, buying aftermarket parts, and buying NOS parts for too many cars in the past. For the most part (with one exception), I stopped that a long time ago. Years ago, after learning this lesson, I have found it better to buy cars already "done" by someone else. That way there are less headaches and you don't bury yourself financially.

It just so happens that I have a car needing total restoration, and it is one my family wants me badly to restore to O.E.M. Gold, and since I am not one to say no to my family (unless I have no choice), I will be seeing this thing to the end. Since I am going to do it, I am going to do it by starting with a perfectly restored car so I don't have to go through every single itsy bitsy part, send them out, have them restored, and pay through the nose.

Thank you for your input.