New TRIM TAG law going into effect in Oklahoma!

[rubbinisracing]

"Void where prohibited"

[Lynn]

Wow. Think I will hang out here for awhile. Much friendlier than over at Camaros.net right now. Although, as someone stated, the opposition is definitely in the minority.

Verne: "whore presentation" OMG, I didn't even notice the typo until you pointed it out. Almost spewed coffee all over the screen. Then I read about Mr. Wadd. I am sure my legal assistant thinks I am in here losing my mind. Thanks man. I needed a good laugh today.


Ed. I need to get up to Tulsa, and have a beer with you. I had corresponded with your good friend Larry just a couple of weeks before he passed, planning to get up there for a beer, but didn't make it in time. Even though I never met him, I felt a connection to him as I do with all the "real car guys" I cross paths with. I think it would be awesome if you and I could meet in person and raise a couple of cold ones to Larry. I know you miss that S.O.B.

Sorry for the personal notes.

BTW, just in case anyone is still reading this, it is the camaraderie of the "real car guys" that make this hobby as great as it is. In a way it is a shame that the economics have become what they are. That is what has brought out all of the snakes. Like Murray (Canucklehead) said: "They will never stop when there is a buck to be made." I just want to make it much more difficult. Hit them in the pocketbook. Since that is what matters most to them, that's where it should hurt the most.

Thanks again for all the support.

Lynn Bilodeau

[VintageMusclecar]

(if I may butcher a snipet of "Hamlet" for a moment...)

Methinks some doth protest too much.

[427king]

Im going to bid the moon on every fake trim tag car out of OK i can find.

[agtw31]

who would enforce the law,the highway patrol?

[SmallHurst]

[ QUOTE ]
who would enforce the law,the highway patrol?

[/ QUOTE ]

Probably so. In Missouri and Kansas, you must actually bring the vehicle in so that title transfer and inspection can occur. Guess who does this? It will not take long for the fakes to be found.

[king_midas]

It's like that in Cali. also, and they also look at the vin. When my wife brought her Honda in, they also looked to make sure the engine number matched; that surprised me.

The cops don't even look at tags; I'm not sure what you mean, SmallHurst....

[Xplantdad]

No Lynn...thank you.

[mrrec]

[ QUOTE ]
No Lynn...thank you.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with Bruce.....

I don't really see a downside to this. The complainers (wonder what their motivation is.....)seem to miss the paragraph about legitimate removal, etc. Resto is covered and exempt the way it appears to me. It's a non-issue.

Dave

[70CitrusZ]

Some random thoughts.....
I just hope this law doesn't impact innocent people negatively. Sure its a great tool in the fight against fraud, but it won't stop the problem, and isn't the total answer.
For one thing,I think that more pressure needs to be put on the manufacturers to come up with and maintain the records on the vehicle data related to the vin.
There should be hell to pay for GM simply saying "we don't have those documents". Once again the onus falls to the little guy and the big corporations are off scott free.
Imagine if you will, that GM was forced to dig up the documents that they have. There would be no question as to the authenticity of a vehicle.
In Canada we are spoiled, because any Canadian sold GM vehicle has micro fiche stored vin based corporate documentation available to anyone with a vin,not just the vehicle owner, so there is no possibility of "faking" a tag to read what you want it to read.

Also, companies that sell replacement trim tags should be forced to visually document damaged originals in order to replace them, and then the original then marked/logged in such a way as to void its further reproduction or alteration. These company's records should be spot checked periodically to validate they are correct and complete.

Another thing is, I know of more than a few people who during a resto, remove the plates from the car to either dip or blast the body, and prevent damage to the plates. Having done that makes them a criminal? I don't feel that is right. A proper and complete concours resto on a rusty shell cannot occur without introducing potentially hazardous materials and processes to the tags, which are really quite fragile. I realize there is provision for this in the law, but what is to stop a person from causing trouble for someone else who has done this for legitimate reason? who is to say if it was a legitimate reason or not? It is now at his cost and expense to prove otherwise that he did not have criminal intention. Even if he is innocent its gonna cost him some money to prove his innocence.

Lastly keep in mind, that in the eighties and early nineties before there was so much aftermarket sheetmetal available, a common and generally accepted way of fixing a really rusty rare car was to re-body it fully or partially.
I really thought nothing of people who were replacing rusty muscle car bodies with six cylinder grandma car rust free bodies, it all seemed fine and good, and actually a lot of people preferred this method as it retained the factory assembly techniques and engineering, which was better than hammered up patch panels ,bondo and chicken wire.
Are the people who currently buy and sell these cars from early restorations headed for the slammer too?.

How exactly does one prove that the current seller of the car made the changes, authorized the changes, or even knew about the changes when the vehicle has had multiple owners, or been farmed out for restoration?.

Another casualty will be people who have been unknowingly ripped off and (also unknowingly) own a fake tagged car. They will potentially be criminals when they do not deserve to be.
Not all car enthusists or owners are experts on their cars, in fact these days more of the opposite is true. More and more of the muscle car owners group, especially the really pricey cars, really don't do anything more than buy and store the cars.
So, simply saying "they should have known, because all us car guys know these two numbers line up to make the tag be legit etc" Is not a fair or accurate statement.

....I think that the law isn't a bad one, but, it most certainly will be nearly impossible to prosecute fairly, anyone under it, unless an eye witness to the illegal activity can be produced, and plenty of evidence supporting that the illegal activity that has taken place, has actually been done by the seller of the vehicle is provided.
Without iron clad irrefutable evidence, it is both unfair and unjust to prosecute a seller of a questionable vehicle.

Just my .02, well maybe .25..I rambled a bit.

Mark