which is best- c.e. or date correct motor?

[Alss]

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks, John. Most likley, a CE block would be a later casting number and certainly a later casting date than correct for a car.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree!
My COPO has a CE block and I have the repair order from the dealer replacing the block under warranty. Block is a Dec 70 512 and was installed in the car in March of 71..Block is stamped CE1XXXXX

ALbert

[427king]

Heres how i see the market in order of preference AND a value for the car scenario 1]original motor 2]original dated block w original build date but no vin 3] alt vin and dated for car build 4] CE motor 5}dated motor w decked pad 6]restamped restoration motor 7]wrong date and decked block With an emphasis on 1-4 being great options and 5-7 being least favorable. I may put CE at #2 spot,especially since the alt vin and no vin blocks may eventually get described as the original motor down the road and the CE will still remain a constant that being a acceptable replacement that could of well come in the car post assembly adn the car can never get misrepresented with it. [ QUOTE ]
In NCRS judging, a blank pad gets a 25-point deduct for no engine plant stamp, a 25-point deduct for no VIN derivative stamp, and a 38-point deduct if the pad surface has been decked; if it's a factory-broached blank pad, there's no pad surface deduction.

A "CE" block pad is judged exactly the same way (-25 for the incorrect engine plant stamp, -25 for the missing VIN stamp, and no surface deduction if the factory-broached pad is showing and is typical).

Most of the block points are allocated to the casting number and date, and less for the pad, and they're judged sequentially (unique only to block judging):



[/ QUOTE ] So my take on that is if you have a CE motor dated for the car you gain 38 points over a decked block thats dated for the car ,because the CE has broach marks..A never stamped block would be even better but harder to find for sure

[L34Pace]

So, basically with judging value directly associated to monetary value it would be in the best interest of the owner to pull a GM issued CE warranty block component in favor of a dated suffix correct block with another cars VIN. Kind of ironic when you consider the fact that GM fully recognized it would have a factored component failure rate and implemented a program to address it. Too bad we cant assume the same and address it in judging criteria

[L34Pace]

[/ QUOTE ] So my take on that is if you have a CE motor dated for the car you gain 38 points over a decked block thats dated for the car ,because the CE has broach marks..A never stamped block would be even better but harder to find for sure

[/ QUOTE ]

The block casting, (350 pts) would be judged first and then the date, (175 pts) and finally the pad with its three elements. Keep in mind that the stops are put in place at the first non comforming data. In the case of a legitimate CE that would be extremely prohibitive unless you used a CE from another vehicle

[427king]

I think Alans orignal question was which of the 2[CE versus decked and dated]made a car worth more. And i believe the answer given those choices is CE. CEs could certainly be dated before the car date. The one thing i disagree on[ok theres more than one !!!] is that if i had a valid CE motor in a corvette id have to take a CE from someone elses car to get more points if there block was dated earlier than my car and the legit CE in my corvette was not. makes no sense.

[Verne_Frantz]

Exactly when did Chevy first start producing "CE" coded replacement engine assemblies?
I've seen replacements from the early '60s with "XX" suffixes and no sequential number.

Verne

[Zedder]

The distinction is really pretty simple...judging compares the car to "as delivered" condition. Since the CE replacement motor would come after delivery, it is not desirable for judging purposes. Those looking to preserve the "history" of a car, would likely prefer a CE block if there was paperwork supporting the warranty work. Personally, since I prefer the "as delivered" category, I would pay more for a properly done "restoration" motor if my original was long gone. It's all a mater of personal preference. Having the correct motor from another car is still not the original to me, so it has no more value than a correctly dated resto motor.

[JoeG]

What would be the definition of a properly done restoration motor................

[Zedder]

One that would get full points in NCRS-type judging - dated, numbered, broach marks etc.

[L34Pace]

I agree with Zedder in that the judging criteria is "as delivered" in the current format. The only difference I see that is not addressed in judging between restoration engines and GM warranty replacements is that the CE was a GM program with a documented proceedure for installation at authorized GM service locations. Restoration engines are individual modifications. Paperwork supporting the warranty exchange should carry the same judging value as that of the "as delivered" paper documentation. Afterall, the window sticker and POP warranty booklet were a component of an "as delivered" vehicle. Ironic that we covet the POP as a documentation tool but dont acknowledge the details spelled out between its covers. Like it or not its part of the GM package.