possible copo

[Zedder]

CJP: I hear what you are saying about a rear swap prior to 1981, but remember it was easier and cheaper back then to swap a rear than rebuild it. In the mid 70's we never rebuilt anything, we just swapped the rear, motor or tranny out for another. Also, as a case in point, my first 67 Z-28 sat in a salvage yard from the 1980 until I bought it in 1998 - I didn't realize it had a BE rear in it until I got it home!

[CJP_69]

Jeff H,
When I heard about this car, I assumed it was possibly an SS 350 car because of the X11D80 tag, disc brakes, 4speed body, 12 bolt etc. The car was never represented as such, just a regular Camaro. My friend bought the car because the previous owner(who purchased it in 1984 and parked it in 1988 until last month) was having trees cut on his mother's property so the car had to go. It wasn't until I got it home when I sanded the corroded rear to check the codes.

Stefano,
I am well aware we are in an age of clones, rebodied cars, fake tags and documentation. These parts may have been swapped, but prior to 1980, I wonder how many actually knew what a COPO was. It's not to say that it couldn't have happened and I realize that. Like I said before, I am trying to look into info on the car's history.

Kurt S
My mistake and my apologies. I am very familiar with JohnZ's posts on camaros.net.
I asked about the radiator dating but I guess no one knows. I have not popped the housing cover to check the posi.

Again I will ask if Mr. Jim Mattison can comment on the statement that he made about the body tag build date in the "Dealer Ordering Procedure" thread.
Thanks for the replies-Chris

[CJP_69]

Kurt S,
Too bad you weren't closer, I'd have you come look at this car. Is there anybody on this site who was actually on the assembly line who can comment on this. Unless you were there, or have documentation from the Norwood plant on actual day to day output and production, to unequivocally say "NO WAY", although you surely have plenty of data to compare, its wrong to make the assumption. If Mr. Mattison could comment on this. On one of his previous posts, he stated that a body for a "special" could be built through the Fisher body plant a few weeks prior to going down the assembly line and that supplying rears were a problem. Maybe you're right. But if a rear switch is the case, according to the previous owner, it would have been done prior to 1980 as this is the way the car was when his friend initially bought it(and owned it from 1981-1984). I asked about date coding on the radiator because it has an "F". Could this also be a June date code, and if so, could the car have gone down the line in June? Maybe someone in the 1970's stripped a June built COPO to build this car. I know it is all speculation, and it's not going to change this car one way or another, but just when you think you know the answer, a car like this changes the question.
Thanks- Chris

[Stefano]

Chris,
It is unlikely that the rear is original to the Camaro based on the data which exists (per Kurt). The COPO clues which you mention point in that direction, but are easily added to the Camaro.

Since you appearantly have a low miles original sheet metal and unrestored Camaro, I would say that it would behoove you to pay for an expert opinion as to the possible status of the car.

With only four owners and the car having been 'local' you would think that there would be more info. available about the Car itself.

What are the dates and part numbers of the internal components like the ring and pinion of your rear axle housing and do all the proper COPO specific items exist?

[Kurt S]

A car was not scheduled until all components were available. When they come off the end of the line, they are ready to ship, not waiting on parts. No plant is big enough to do that...... JohnZ was there and confirms that. I worked in assembly plants and confirm that.

#'s look like a COPO, axle doesn't look original to the car. Could be they swapped with another racer, who knows....
I never assumed it was wrong, I said I doubt it is the original axle. Please don't say I said something I didn't.

BTW Jeff, 11,000 cars is about 2 weeks production......

[Jeff H]

I doubt it's the original rear as well. 2 weeks is a long time frame for a car to have been started and then sit around waiting for a component like a BE rear. I would think they would stick a regular 4.10 rear in a car to keep the line moving then pull something aside like that. Chris, what are the dates on the other components inside the rear? Are there any signs that the rear could have been removed at some point in it's life or are the u-bolts so rusted that it looks like it's been there forever? Kurt, does CRG have any cars on record that have documentation like the p-o-p with a rear that was stamped incorrectly? I'm wondering what the chances would be that it's an 0510 rear that was stamped 0610? I just think it's a curious situation and the car sure seems to be a COPO but the rear really throws an odd curve. I still think it would be an amazing coincidence that someone would end up swapping one BE rear for another BE rear especially if most people didn't even know the significance of those rears way back when. This is the kind of stuff that helps us all learn more so I hope I'm not wasting anyone's time with my comments! [img]/ubbthreads/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[CJP_69]

Jeff H,
I haven't pulled the cover yet to check the rear internals.
The car has rusted J bolt traction bars. Axle tubes have extra welding to center section and leafspring buckets are tack welded to body. A BE swap with that close of a date is absolutely possible but how probable. In the Dealer Order Procedures thread, T Billigen states he has a February dated Yenko with a March rearend. Is that rear original? Maybe he can reply.

Kurt S,
Do you have data on any 05E COPO with body number or vin before or after this car with known rear end dates?
Thanks-Chris

[Jeff Murphy]

For what it's worth my COPO (current feature car) is an 06A trim tag date (351185 BDY) and a BE0616G1 rear end in it. As far as I know, it hasn't been swapped.