1969 Trans Am Convert Clone

[GTO_DON]

[copo9566aa]

Just Curious for what exactly 366 HP no more logic 365 HP
350 HP
360 HP
366 HP
370 HP
Another Pontiac mystery

[Steve_Hoog]

Jeff

Yes catalog's aren't the best reference. In this ones defense; the 1983 version from which this came, all of the non-serviced and discontinued parts had been long weeded out of this catalog. Anything left in this catalog at time of print, was close as it will get to good.

I so wish I still had my families dealership records for 69 sold cars, I studied them like the Bible until they left my possession in 91. 69 was my favorite year, and I had removed some of the records on 69 from storage. I can remember several things that were way off target from what is generally talked about, this H.O. thing was one of them. I wondered why these 69 GTO's had H.O. listed in the GM paperwork yet know one ever talked about it or referenced it.

I can remember street racing with my cousin Gary Hoog; who was old enough to drive at the time, in a 68 dark green Bird. I remember it so well because I was fascinated with the hood tach. 5 years old sitting on my knees watching the needle on the hood, was very impressionable. Later in life I had to ask him what year it was, he was stunned that I remembered the hole thing. And more surprised I remembered what kind of car, color, and the hood tach. As kids we used to fight over the plastic models that GM put out, king of the hill got the GTO's and Birds. So we did have a perspective of what the models were at an early age. Later when I was old enough to read and cared, I studied all of the internal paperwork deligently.

Some of it is still around in the old building, and I have plans to retrieve it. So I may be able to share some of it with you in the near future, for those Pontiac people interested.

Steve

[DaJudge]

Steve,
I just got off the phone with the receptionist 10 minutes ago at Ernie Miller Pontiac. I know some people here may not like my posts, but I have never lied to them and have always answered them or made posts to the best of my knowledge.

Why then when I asked the receptionist if you or your family owned the dealership did she said NO?

This hobby for the most part is made of hard working and honest people. Is your life that boring that you need to make up stories? What's your real deal?

[Pantera]

He only works at Ernie Miller now. They owned a small town dealer ship not Ernie Millers. He has showed me the pic of it.

[Steve_Hoog]

This is border line stalking.....

I have posted numerous family pics of my family's dealership under Cool Judge Photo thread. My family's dealership was in Muskogee OK at 6th and Court (last location). My great grandfather W.A. Kuykendall started it in 1938, my uncles sold out in 84 or 85. This pic is one that I have already posted, but here it is again.

My uncles decided to cut and run with the money without consulting the rest of the family, much to my disappointment. I had always intended to be the next one to take the reigns, but I was still in college at the time. Ernie Miller Pontiac is 45 minutes away in Tulsa, Ernie was kind enough to hire me before he died. I now work for Marc Miller, who still keeps it under his dad's name.

I sure hope that will do it for you.

[StealthBird]

Wow, this thread is getting strange.

Back to the references on factory literature, factory brochures are not good reference material. The 1969 Firebird sales brochure shows the Firebird 350 H.O. with dual hood tach nacelles. The passenger side nacelle had a Ram Air hose connected to a modified air cleaner. This setup never saw production. Heck, there are also errors in the factory 1969 Pontiac Service Manual . Some errors were corrected later via Pontiac bulletins, others were not. The most obvious error is a photo showing the different Pontiac V8 pistons, from the 428 to the RAIV. The captions under the photo are reversed.

GM had schedules to keep, profit margins to watch, employees to control, and they weren't thinking of future collectability. If something was wrong when the customer received their car (not a flaw, but a factory goof up), the dealer would correct it. What I've heard lately are more and more stories from the folks that were actually ON the assembly line, and they recall supplier problems, glitches in the machinery, even times when employees called in sick and someone filled in they weren't as careful as the regular employee, or vice-versa. If a supplier went on strike, or was late on their delivery, substitute parts were used. It happened all the time. The assembly line would not stop unless it was a serious problem with a major part.

That being said, we now have people 35 years later debating bolt head depth, washer design, the percentage of gloss in an A-arm, exhaust pipe hangers, etc. That's one of the problems I see with reproduction parts. Once a part is reproduced, everyone has the exact same part, and that's not necessarily correct. There WERE factory mistakes and goofs, and sometimes they used alternative parts for a day or two until the supplier was back in stock.

Some 69 Trans Am's had the stripes under the rear wing, some over the wing. Some were missing the front bumper arrowhead (supposed to be part of the Firebird 400 package), and some had hood scoop decals. Pre-production publicity photos show the 69 Trans Am without a front spoiler. Go figure....

[Steve_Hoog]

And maybe you should ask a question or two before firing off blanks, an apology is expected.

[GTO_DON]

YOU DONT OWE HIM AN APOLOGY MIKE. HE'S BEEN MAKING EVERYBODY ON THIS BOARD BELIEVE HE OWNED THE DEALERSHIP HE WORKS AT SINCE HE JOINED THIS SITE! JUST A PARTS GUY EH! WOW IT MAKES ALL THAT RAM V STUFF WORTH IT NOW.

[Steve_Hoog]

Because I have referred to the dealership I work at as "my dealership" and "our dealership", that means I have claimed to be the "owner/ dealer principal"?

"My or our" is a point of reference, not ownership. Back in the first thread I participated in, I said that "I work at a dealership". I did have a typo in leaving out "at", but I suppose the meaning was some what clear. Then if some one was so interested in my life to investigate it, a big clue should have been that my family's dealership was in Muskogee (and the current ownership still is open and in Muskogee), Ernie Miller is in Tulsa. I believe I mentioned Kuykendall and Muskogee a few times?

I didn't know where I worked was so important to you and Don? All you had to do was ask, then if I did make an inaccurate claim you could have had me dead on. Instead, both of you have taken a vague misdirected assumption and turned into personal slander.

Don.... I don't like you at all. But I have totally left you alone since the time you lost your cool and got temporarily banned from the board. I promise you my feelings for you are now worse.

Dajudge... Even though we butted heads at first, I have tried to be nice to you and keep it at a friendly tone. Please don't talk to me anymore, don't call my work, my family, or try to contact my dog.