70 Judge RAIV and V continuation

[sixtiesmuscle]

Nice legswork Rita.

[L67WT1]

Jeff I agree that it would be cool to find out how the RA V got in that Judge and if it in fact had some race history like the Tin Indian, but I think that being installed at the factory or engineering is becoming a beatin horse issue. Unlike the 68 Z-28 Covert which had documentation to support that it is the real deal the supposed RA V car in question does not.

I like all musclecars but have been a Pontiac person for a long time. Pontiac guys always love to talk about the RA V as the Hemi or Chevy Rat beater. Although it pains me to write this Chevrolet was always and is GM's racing flagship and when MacDonald took over at Pontiac a lot of programs were stopped. Look at Pontiac today they pulled out of NASCAR. With Toyota coming into the sport you can bet dollars to donuts that all the Racing program money that was earmarked for Pontiac will be given to Chevrolet. ( I know that's a little off topic)to kick Toyotas butt.

[MrsBillyBobcat]

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Nice legswork Rita.

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Thanks Mike! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

BTW...was that "s" suppose to be in there? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] Or was your mind somewhere else? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif[/img]

(just kidding!)

Rita [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[sixtiesmuscle]

Uh, just a lousy typist. Don't tell MR. Billy.

[Jeff H]

I think this thread has made some great progress on helping with this particular car. If the car was indeed shipped and delivered in Nov like it appears, and the engine in it was not built until Jan, then that lends a lot of proof that it didn't come in the car new. That's basically what was being asked for in the first thread. Can someone help document or verify the car and engine. I don't know why some people are getting all worked up over the car or information, but together as a whole, this group has produced some great research and evidence. I still think it's interesting to see the "WY" codes on these engines. It sure makes you think they were intended to go in as production engines to receive a production code. Those articles you posted Rita also may help prove that the stamping on the engine Steve posted is an original Pontiac stamp(hand stamped in Engineering) on a RA V engine. This information together has a lot of value.
[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggthumpup.gif[/img]

[MrsBillyBobcat]

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Rita, did that other engine you were referring to have the "WY" code on it as well?

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Yes, it did (see the articles that I attached to the bottom of my post from last night). From what I have read, "WY" is the correct code for a GTO with a manual transmission.

Rita [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Steve_Hoog]

Jeff

As we draw close to the end of this one car...

Something else that has come out of this. If anyone pops their hood claiming to have a RAV block in the bay, they better have their business together if anyone that followed this thread sees it.

[L67WT1]

First of all regarding the date code theory. Pontiac did make some Ram Air V blocks in 69.They were in fact developed for Trans Am racing (303CID) and strip tested in a 69 GTO (400 cid) first. Are you trying to say that if this motor pre-dates the car that it is the real deal. Well I don't believe that. It just means someone purchased a date coded 69 block.

The block in the artcle Mrs Billybobcat attached was date coded 70. The serial production number you are trying to validate is later in the sequence and should have a later date code. If anyone knows RA V's the Shultzes do they have a lot of documentation and a car that is documented.

A 69 car with documentation but a 70 car without, why do you think someone would not document that 70 car? It's only a year later. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif[/img]

Things that make you go hmmmmmmmm!

[Jeff H]

Yup, these threads have presented some great information. Kind of reminds me about the 283's that some of the 67 Camaros got when they were running low on 327's. The best way to prove or disprove something is to get the most research and evidence together. Even the 68 Camaro 327 TH350 cars weren't thought to be original until they found a bunch of them to help document them. And based on Dan's research into the Hauser ZL1's, I'm open to the possibility that they made more than 69 ZL1 Camaros. I've seen the ads and nobody can identify the mysterious blue car that they had. I'll save that for another argument, I mean discussion.

[L67WT1]

Yes I agree about the codes, but it may be quite simple; if Pontiac was going to have the engines certified for emissions and production to meet AMA specifications then they would have to ship one of each an automatic RA V engine and a manual RA V engine to the emissions testing labs. Vacuum lines and some emissions plumbing were different between autos and sticks. Why is it difficult to believe that they had codes for these engines?

There is no question regarding a RA V engines existence only if it was factory or dealer installed that is where all the commotion came from. After all it's only a piece of iron and it is not worth arguing about or coming down on people for differing opinions [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/flag.gif[/img]