Hello Ryan. I seldom comment on your thread, but have continued to follow religiously. I don't know that there would have been even one thing I would have done differently. Great choices all the way through to the current day; including the drive down the gravel road. You and your family are what this hobby SHOULD be about. It is the classic car hobby at its very best.

I feel your pain on the gravel road story. Not to hijack, but in Sept. 2015, my daughter got married at the chapel across the street from our home in downtown Gutthrie. We had the reception at our place (about 80 people). I took her and my son in law to their honeymoon destination in my 1964 Vanden Plas Princess (antique looking rh drive British limo). I spent a day and a half making the old Princess look the part. I had no idea the honeymoon destination was down three miles of gravel / red dirt roads! What a mess? However, no regrets. i would do it again in a heartbeat.

Here she is sitting out in front of our "house" (we live in a converted Livery Stable) after I got her cleaned up again.

Lynn,
I so appreciate this commentary!! I had to make decisions at every step and to show off the good the bad and the ugly was always a choice..... (for example... the metal replacement behind the rear wheels could have easily been left on the cutting room floor) for someone experienced like yourself to like my curved torturous path just makes me happy!!

I love your limo, it would really show off red mud and gravel dust :-)

It was so nice to meet a couple years ago, hope we get to cross paths again soon.

Ryan W31

PS: a wonderful story exactly on the conversation topic is not thread stealing!!

Hope to see you and your son again as well. Hey, compared to some of the talent on this site, I am just a hack. But I have fun doing it.

Status:

Shake, Rattle and Roll....

The car has a shake, I hope it relates to the driveshaft. I have a new one built but need to shorten the slip yoke and possibly shorten the driveshaft.... I will measure and move ahead this week.

The shifter ter is not happy. I can get it into some gears some of the time but I need to get this sorted out before any spirited vroom vrooms.

Funny sound.... I have a feeling the sound I am hearing is an exhaust leak. I catastrophize naturally so I need to get this under wraps shortly.

Fuel mileage.... it seems to enjoy fuel :-)

Some lights need to be replaced/fixed. Dome light, dash lights, etc.

Brakes take a little (lot) of getting used to. They function as intended as far as I can tell. After Prom I had the opportunity to test them, a dingbat pulled out in front of me and I locked it up. I was impressed the car stopped quick enough for me to share a single finger communication and drive around said dingbat. I shared a verbal communication but the windows were up.... I am confident my message was clear.

Odds and ends, of course there are lots of other items to sort out over time but these are the hot topics.

Ryan W31

Driveshaft part deux... shortened up the slip yoke some. Had some little spigots made up so I can measure the driveshaft by myself. One end has a slot for the measuring tape and one end has a point to measure too. (Pretty snazzy) after careful measuring and remeasuring I am confident the DS is too long. On various sites I have seen that one inch of travel is needed and I have zero. 56 inches center to center with the yoke pushed all the way in till it bottoms out in the trans and the DS measures 56 inches. I will have it shortened. Now the tricky part...... I want to be able to use a Chevy rear as well as an Olds rear... by memory the Chevy rear Center of the yoke is closer to the trans than the Olds rear. (Tough to explain....) in summary I think I can have the DS shortened 2 inches and it will be good for Olds 3R or in future if I install a 1350 yoke in an Olds rear or in future if I install a Chevy rear with a 1350 u joint.....


Ryan W31

Ryan: Nice little spigots for measuring.

Are you sure you want to shorten it 2 full inches? I can't imagine that you would even be able to get it installed (and apparently you did, or you wouldn't be talking about a driveline vibration) if it were two inches too long.

Did you measure free play on the slip yoke with the drive shaft installed and the car resting on all four wheels? If you are at zero, I would think taking off one inch would get you your one inch of free travel. Hate to see you have it shortened TOO much.

What I see in the first pic looks like you still have about a 1/4 inch free play. That would mean only shortening the DS by 3/4 inch. I know sometimes it is hard to explain and show with pics over the web.

Also, do you know the difference in the distance from back of the trans to the Olds rear as opposed to the Chevy rear? If it is more that 1/2 inch, you might need different driveshafts for each rear.

Hi Lynn, I know why this post is confusing..... I posted part 2 but not part 1.

Part 1:

I am sorting out the driveshaft this week. The new heavy duty unit is made with 3.5” OD 0.084” wall thickness tube (steel so it is PSMCDR compliant) 1350 U joints, (the rear u joint is half 1350, half 3R) Spicer 27 spline slip yoke. The DS is the same length as original but the SL is much bigger in a few directions and the SL shaft has a step that the original didn’t have..... maybe the DS is too long.... I knew I have to shorten the SL so that should be step one then I can get proper measurements.

I added some measurements of inside the SL and how far the trans output shaft sticks out the back of the trans.

Ryan W31

PS: I installed the original for prom as the new HD DS looked too long, now I am getting this sorted out.

Makes more sense now. Just didn't want you to get it too short. Easy to shorten.

I now know lots about driveshafts :-) learning is fun!!

Ryan W31

PS:

Driveshaft part 3, I supported the frame and let the rear suspension hang down. I then remeasured centre to centre and see 55 5/16”, when the rear suspension was up (supported on jack sands) the measurement was 56”. I will drop off the DS after work one day next week and take this item off the punch list.

Every inch is a mile.

Got my driveshaft back tonight shortened by one inch.
It is perfect now as I could just install it at full droop and easily (relative term as this DS is a brute) install with rear suspension up.

This went so well I proceeded to start fitting my driveshaft loop..... moved the exhaust clamps on the X pipe.... that helped.... and I have a plan to bend the flat bottom piece up slightly and tilt the circle more to the same angle as the DS... I need a little more room at the top of the circle.... (I would say progressive progressioning..... close to progress)

Ryan W31

Yep, that brand safety loop all need a bit of custom fitting.....especially now that you went with a larger DS.
What? No stripes and an all black DS.....your losing your Mo-Jo.


Dan

In future I need to go bare steel and add the purple and black stripes. Agree I am so busy lately I am having a hard time getting car stuff done, (and paint daubs are on hold:-))

There is an Olds show very close to me June 23rd, I am trying to get back on the road for this event.

Need to plan ice cream

Need to plan a visit to the Stagers

Need to make a plan... spread sheet time :-)

Ryan W31

So I attained another goal today!! I drove my car to the Oldmsobile Club of Ontario OCO Show. To and from with no issues.

I have lots of small items to sort out but the most predominant are sorted.

I was able to meet up with many friends and meet some new ones too!!! Sam Grewal, Ranjit, Shane P, Steve P (Mopar) Wes and Marty Hodgson, and many more.

I played my car Show game and selected a 1970 F85, - - Rallye Red, W31, W27, 4 speed, B90, Drag car early in life, Canadian sold in Kitchener Ontario at Orr Chev/Olds.

Great day all around, I even snuck out for another rip after dinner.

Now I will make plans to visit the Stagers (now that my car actually drives with a tiny confidence level.)

Ryan W31

Nice :)

Dan

I have been working away at my car, I didn’t want to share till I had a better feel for what’s up. I have been chasing a noise I don’t like. It sounds like a rocker. I have talked to Comp Cams tech support, and the engine builder. (Both were helpful) I am still working through all the potentials to get to the bottom of this.

I stayed with the PSMCDR compliant non roller rockers, I hate the whole concept of these metal on metal archechic crap but I digress.
All 16 push rods spin at idle.
All rocker bolts were tight.
There are no signs of debris, under each valve cover is spotless.
The entire valve train is Comp Cams.
I did cold starts with one valve cover off (passenger one day, drivers the next day) made a mess but saw what I would consider proper oil flow after a normal short delay.
There seems to be 0.100” of lifter preload. (My measurements are ok but I am kind of getting a feel for this....) CC says 0.050” to 0.060” is the minimum... I didn’t ask yet what the max is....
A few push rods are close to the side of the hole as they pass through the head. CC wasn’t concerned he said the Chrome moly pushrods I used are fine even if it does touch the side..... this kind of put his advice in question to me but I listened.

More pictures and videos to share but need some shut eye.

Again I didn’t want to share but have had so much support over the years I figured what the heck. For some reason I had a feeling the boutique 25K engine build would be resuggested, (my insecurities took over)

Ryan W31

Just to make sure, put a stethascope on the top of the fuel pump and listen for a ticking noise. If the sping is broken, it can sound JUST LIKE a loose rocker.

Thanks Lynn.

That is one spot I have not checked with the stethoscope.

Question: can you hear an exhaust leak with a stethoscope? I have listened to the exhaust from above with it but don’t hear anything untoward...

I should say that I didn’t hear any noises during the run in or dyno tuning, so the potential exsists that this pesky sound is an accessory bolted on afterward.

When the lifters are on the base circle I can spin the pushrods which I gather is a good sign. At the same time the rocker can be pushed side to side making the exact same sound I don’t like..... so far my most likely root cause is that the rockers and pivots make this much noise naturally and it is normal. TBD.

The original pivots are aluminum (by memory) but this CC set up is all hard steel (possibly louder due to steel on steel vs steel on aluminum?)

Moving forward each day!!

Ryan W31

PS: we are making a date with the Stagers for a first cruise but holidays are getting in the way.... it may be August before we go for ice cream..... this is letting me sort out issues anyways.

Take the probe off the stethescope and listen with the open vac hose for an exhaust leak.

If you get close to an exhaust leak, you will know it immediately.

The exhaust leak will also be slightly louder under a slight load, so best way is to have someone in the car (that you TRUST) put it in drive with their foot on the brake and give it just enough gas to get it over 1000 rpm. Exhaust noise will be more pronounced.

Good luck.

'

Adding to Lynn's good advice above, exhaust leaks are best checked w/ engine cold as some disappear when engines warm up.
Have you tried removing the belts and running the engine for a moment without WP/Alt etc turning as this may help isolate whether they may be the problem or not?
Another thing to try is disconnecting each plug lead individually one by one w/ engine running to see if the sound changes...this sometimes helps indicate which cyl. has the problem as you're removing detonation from the cyl. and they're now only rotating.
Doubtful w/ a fresh engine but sometimes listening at the tailpipe and carb w/ air cleaner removed helps indicate bad valves...exhaust valve if TP noise and Intake if @ carb.

Great to hear you're getting closer to taking the Stagers for a rip!
Please say hello for me also LMK when it's happening as there's a small chance I may be able to drop by on one of my trips to/from Woodstock as I'm usually there about once a month.
:beers:
~ Pete


.

Thanks Lynn, I will try the no probe listening.

My car is a 4 speed so I will have my hunny rev it up a little.

Ryan W31

Thanks for the advice!!!

I will let you know as soon as we agree on a date!!

Ryan W31

Have you gone through the car and checked to make sure evrything is tight? Often times, after items run through heat cycles the hardware needs to be tightened/adjusted. Get the engine up to normal operating temperature and then check exhaust manifold bolts; the noise, if it a loose bolt, should disappear after tightening if that is the cause for your ticking noise. Valvetrain noise and exhaust leaks can have a very similar sound. You said you have Comp Cams parts that are replacements of original style? Is this correct? If so, you shouldn't have an issue as originally, there really wasn't any further adjustment after installation. I doubt FJ would've harmed anything in the dyno room; he is a seasoned veteran and knows the ropes. Does the noise get louder or change when the engine is warm/hot? Kinda hard to do with a stick, but as others have asked, does it change under a load? If you have to, jam on the e-brake, put chocks on all four wheels, and let clutch slip a bit while in first gear and see if what you're hearing changes; do this only as a last resort, and if you aren't comfortable trying it, don't. Unplug PCV and see what happens; I've seen dimestore PCV valves make noise, but not loud enough to mimick an exhaust leak. Is your heat riser working properly?
Other members have given great advice/ideas to isolate noise.

As always Great advise Dave.....true on the PCV Valves.

Dan

"My car is a 4 speed so I will have my hunny rev it up a little."

I knew that.... brain fart.

With a manual trans, the exhaust leak (if it is one) will normally be a little louder under light load at very low rpm... just as you are starting out.

Awesome info guys!!

Now I need to work through this list.

Ryan W31

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HDRoGlfNUo4

The sound I don’t like is exactly like when I push the rocker side to side but muted.

Ryan W31

I am getting more and more confident that the mechanical noise I was concerned about is normal for this valve train.

Friends stopped by last night and Laura’s Dad sent me another Olds book. (He wanted it to go to a good home, Yup)

I took the guys for a little cruise and pushed the right pedal a little further, I like it, this car feels quick, I even did a little traction test and there is zero lag both black stripes start at the same time :-)

The shifter is functional but nowhere near usable for PSMCDR so I need to “shift” my focus back to the shifter :-) The Competition Plus has such a long throw, between gears the knob has to move like half a foot.... I am so tempted to follow in Al’s foot steps and put the Street Super Shifter back in the car that he installed back in the day. I would use the red H Boot that Pete Leathersac sent me to dress it out..... Hmmmmm.....

Ryan W31

Some jerk put two black marks on my street. Any suspects? (The gravel was on the exit side of the vroom vroom)

:-)

Ryan W31

So yet another life bucket list item planned out.

August 13th after dinner we are heading for the Stagers for the first cruise since 1976.

Pete Leathersac, I sure hope you can come for ice cream.

Ryan W31

Amy and I took the Cutlass for a weekend camping and for a car show on the beach. (Sauble Beach)

This was about 1.5 hours drive each way, the longest drive since 1976 by far!! When we were half hour from home the car stopped going into some, then all gears. I think I didn’t tighten the jam but on the clutch adjustment rod enough and it came loose.... at least I hope this is what happened. That rod is close to the exhaust so I couldn’t touch it, tomorrow I will have a good look. I hope it’s not a big deal as Tuesday we are taking the Stagers for a cruise.... drama.... now we go to commercial and after commercial everything works out Tickedy boo.

We had so much fun it was like a weeks vacation!!!

Ryan W31

Here are a few pictures.

All smiles before the gear issue and after, we drove in fourth gear through 3 little towns, then first gear through our town.

Ryan W31

Also a nice note from Lynn Stager on FB.

Adjusted the clutch rod and all’s well. (That thing really kills the whole experience if it comes loose)

Weather looks good for tomorrow evening.

I am super excited to take the Stagers for a cruise!!

Life is good!!

Ryan W31

Good times Ryan.

Well done :)

Dan

Another bucket list item checked off in style!!!

Amy and I visited the Stagers for a lovely dinner, followed by a cruise. I am always thinking and scheming.... I had it set up that we would visit Terry Denomme (editor of Bone Stock and Modified Muscle Cars Magazine) so he could visit and take a few pictures, one thing lead to another and he is up on a truck taking photos of the car and us :-) It just so happened that friends of the Stagers live on the same street as Terry’s Dad’s shop so we visited with them and got to see their 1971 MGB. We then cruised to a nice ice cream shop and enjoyed some ceremonial ice cream cones.

What a wonderful night!!!

I gave a copy of Bone Stock that has our old car inside to Al.

Ryan W31

Some pictures from tonight.

Great adventure!

That Ice Cream looks Yummy :)

Dan

Sweeter than ever before!!!

2 reasons... this was the first ride in their Cutlass since 1976, but also we have been eating healthy for months so Ice cream hit my taste buds like a hammer :-)

Ryan W31

Lots more to come!!

This was a crazy night, we cruised around in the Cutlass and saw an MGB, and a 65 Chevelle and 59 pro touring wagon at Terry’s... old cars were coming out of the woodwork everywhere.

Ryan W31

Ryan sounds like you and Amy and the Stagers had a great time. The cruise and the pictures and of course the ice cream all are great you guys had a ball. Hi to the Stagers as one original owner to another and to you and Amy, have fun buddy.
Chuck