I think Bill is talking about "Southside Machine Bars". This is a brand name but they locate the rear of the lower control arm lower than stock. I've used them in the past and noticed no difference in ride quality. JMO

These bars don't affect the ride at all. The bars that are similar to leaf spring bars might. The holes in the 3 "fingers" would require you to drill thru the "fins" on the diff housing for a long bolt to go thru. If you prefer to not do that, they still work well.

https://static.summitracing.com/glob...a1-5213_xl.jpg

Yes, the QA-1 bars are the ones I am considering - but I did see where one person had said they made the car ride worse. But you can hear anything, especially in the internet era.
The South Side Machine bars are not legal for the Pure Stock Muscle Car Races.

If the QA-1 bars help with traction - as well as stopping the wheel hop - I should be able to get my 60 foot times into the 1.9 sec. area - as I had several 2.07 60 foot times this year.

Sorry, I glossed over the part that you were participating in the pure stock drags. Olredalert, my apologies if I put words in your mouth about what you were referencing.

What are you running for shock absorbers ? Good, HD shocks will help curb the rebound of the diff/springs releasing tension. The stop hop bars relocate the upper control arm higher at the diff to give the suspension a better geometry to combat the hopping.

----Thanks for a better explanation, Mitch. Yes, stop hop bars push the instant center about three feet forward and the result is no hop! Used them on Red Alert with great outcome....Bill S

I don’t have a wheel hop issue, I think mostly as I used my original coil springs and the lower control arms are horizontal.

I have lots of upgrades coming for PSMCDR 2024, hop stop bars, 4.10 gears, solid upper and lower rear control arms, air bags, station wagon brakes, you name it!!!

Great to meet!!

Ryan W31

Ryan, I assume you mean tubular control arms but with urethane bushings ?

The '70 SS I bought in '73 had solid arms with no bushings and no provision to grease anything. The holes in the diff and frame brackets were pounded out almost twice the size from the PO racing it. I had to get new, original, arms from the dealer, center everything with a tape and weld washers on all the brackets to keep it in place.

I am keeping things very close to stock, Just going to change to Hotchkiss control arms that look stock (I’ll take off the silly stickers) but are more rigid than my original FE2 boxed lowers and open uppers.

PS: even though Al Stager ordered FE2 rear suspension it didn’t come with the rear lower frame braces so I added those…. I am confident they also help prevent wheel hop by connecting and triangulating between upper and lower rear control arms.

Ryan W31

I'm using KYB Gas-Adjust mono-tube shocks, and the car has the rear lower frame braces along with boxed lower control arms and the rear anti-sway bar. And as I've mentioned it has all new Moog control arm bushings. Car is not jacked-up and the lower control arms set fairly level. Car has stock rear coil springs from a 1970 SS Chevelle - I mentioned earlier in this thread that the car had extra tall and awful stiff springs in it when I got it. Some people though that was because of the slicks that must have been used on it at some time in the past.
But whatever - I'm experiencing wheel hop and it must be stopped.
Right now I need to get the pinion leak stopped. All the new parts have arrived so I've got to get the mechanic to give me a date to bring the car.

Order the stop hops now and have them on hand for when you can get the car in for the pinion. Get the bars installed at the same time ..:wink:

That's what I've been thinking also Mitch. Although i would be able to install the bars myself

I did get the new pinion yoke and Ratech seal installed - so now we'll see how that goes, hopefully all will be fine.
The mechanic didn't want to install the Stop Hop bars. That's OK - no problem.
But reading the instructions They talk about the pinion angle and keeping it the same. i guess I thought the bars would be designed - so that when bolted in place - they would keep the pinion angle in the stock factory location, but maybe I'm wrong ?????
But lets say I don't install the Stop Hop bars - what shocks should I try to stop the wheel hop? Will shocks alone stop the wheel hop?
Thanks for the help - any and all is appreciated

No, shocks along won't help much.
I think the hop instructions mention the pinion angle to cover their rear and for the installer/owner to check that angle. The 2 pair I installed did not change it enough to mess with.

Removing the original rubber bushings from the control arms and installing polyurithane bushings will make a huge difference.

Ouch - the new pinion yoke and Ratech seal are leaking. At this point i don't even know what it's going to take to stop it from leaking. But we'll try again - what else can I do.

Doing some measuring while I wait on he mechanic to work on the pinion seal again - I've done some measuring and angle finding.
Looks like I need to lower the rear of my car - as the rear lower control arms are pointing upwards about 8 degrees. I don't know that I understand why, as the rear springs are from a 1970 Chevelle SS 396 that didn't have A/C or anything on it.
Is there a known good spring for these cars - or should I get lowering springs?
Anyway, if I can get the lower control arms level that should angle the top control arms down - hopefully that would help my wheel hop problem.
Thanks for any help!!!!!

Tom inspect leak closely and make sure leak isn't weeping through pinion/yoke splines I always add permatex to splines on end of yoke when I assemble a rear for this reason

Thanks Zman. Yes, that is what the mechanic doing this work for me has been doing, I've watched him each time. And the drip is not coming from the area around the pinion nut - it's on the dust shield part of the yoke. There is also no drip or oil film on the bottom of the rear end housing (like the leak was around the outside of the seal).
I did find an old picture of the 1969 Chevelle SS I had in 1969 - and the rear end of the car is sitting much lower than the 1969 Chevelle I have now. I don't really understand why, as I have what I believe to be "stock" used 1970 Chevelle SS rear springs now. Of course I don't know if someone changed the springs in the 1970 Chevelle, that these springs came out of, years ago - and they are not really stock.
But anyway, I will need to get some springs that will lower the my car in the rear about 2 1/2 inches.
If anyone has any information on rear springs that will set the car at stock ride height - I could sure use the help.
Thanks

I ordered some rear springs from Summit Racing - BMR SP014 - that were supposed to lower the car 1" ..... but mine only dropped about 3/8" .... I ordered these after talking to tech support at BMR. I called their tech dept. again and they said to loosen the control arm bushing bolts and re-tighten at ride height - I did that but it didn't help.
So now I've ordered their 2" drop springs - they should be here about Monday and hopefully they will drop the car down.
Again - if anyone has any information on rear springs that will put the car at a ride height that will help control rear axle hop - please let me know.

When loosening the control arm bolts, are you doing all 8, or only 4 ? Also, can you turn the bolts to know they aren't seized in the bushing sleeve ?

Yes, I loosened all 8 control arm bolts (uppers are a pain) - but I didn't really feel as it was necessary, as it hasn't been that long since i rebuilt the rear suspension and everything was tightened then at ride height.
But with loosening the bolts and bouncing the rear of the car up and down - the 1' lowering springs didn't lower my car over 3/8 inch. Could that be because the springs in my car - that I got from a friend of mine - really are stock 1970 Chevelle SS springs with 170,000 miles on them, and they have sagged some? But if that is the case, why is my car still to high in the rear?
Oh well, 2' lowering springs are on the way - so we'll see.

So I got the 2" lowering springs and installed them - they worked great - car now sits level (as measured from the top of the rocker panel to the level garage floor).
Test drive showed no signs of wheel-hop. Of course this was not on a prepared racing surface where I will get better traction - so we'll see. But I do hope the wheel-hop is gone.
ALSO: since the car sits different now - the leak at the pinion seal runs down the bottom of the rear end housing, it's not dripping off the dust shield on the pinion yoke. As soon as my mechanic gets to me, I think he is going to re-do the pinion seal and put extra sealant around the outside of the seal. I certainly hope that will fix it this time.

please show us how it sits with 2" lowering springs and what brand and PN on springs

Sure Zman1969. The springs are BMR SP015R. There is also a revision code letter at the end of the part number on the spring (it doesn't show up when ordering) - I don't remember right off the top of my head what it was on my springs.

Well - my mechanic put in another new pinion seal yesterday. This time he put extra sealant around out side of the seal. I'll have to check later today and see if there is any leaks - but hopefully there won't be this time.
Also - in looking at all the seals which we have used - I'll have to say the National seal and the Ratech seal - are the exact same seal.

Any leaks??(fingers crossed)

No leaks .... that's great !!!!!

Glad it worked this time and stays dry, Tom.

On to the next issue - seems that there are a lot of little issues when trying to get a car back on the road in workable condition.
The mechanic (fixing the pinion seal) noticed that my right rear brake drum was dragging a little. You could hear that there was a high spot on the brake drum by the rubbing sound when turning the axle. So I had the brake drum turned by a friend who has a muffler and brake shop. The brake drum was a little out of round - so that has now been fixed.
OK - I took this car to the Pure Stock Drag Races in Michigan this past Sept. Later in the day the car slowed down. After making several runs between 13.90 - 14.10 .... the car suddenly ran 14.30. I went right back and made another pass and went 14.60. So I knew something was wrong - but what. My guess was maybe ignition, so I put in a different distributor. Car did improve to 14.20 - but that was the best it would do the rest of the weekend.
Now I'm wondering if it was the brake shoes rubbing - holding the car back.
I don't think the "self-adjusters" should over adjust the brakes - but could the out of round brake drum have caused an issue, where the brakes over tightened.
The car doesn't miss-fire. O2 sensor in the exhaust doesn't show the car to be running out of gas. Yet the car slowed down.
Any thoughts .......?

Heat in the engine. My car will slow down a lot as the engine temp goes up. It runs good at 150, but slows down as it gets to 180, and then slows down a lot above that. If you made a pass and went right back and made another one without cooling off any then that might be the problem.

I wanted to say Merry Christmas to everyone who has helped me - but l've been sick with a head cold and haven't been going online. Thanks again for all the help.

Sorry to hear you have been under the weather. Hope you get to feeling better soon.

Just an update - after getting over a head cold, a few weeks later I came down with Type A flu, but I'm much better now and will be getting back to work on the Chevelle.
Still haven't made up my mind as to why the car slowed down. I know engine heat could do it, but the car was still slower the next day, when it had had plenty of time to cool.
I believe the old, used, engine may have just been going away.
Don't know if I'll get to the track to see what it does early this year, after making sure the rear brakes are backed off, or if I will just tear the engine down.

After looking at the engine, and finding a little bit of rust on the inside of one of the valve covers (there might have been more if the inside of the valve covers hadn't been chromed as well as they are, I don't know) - I've decided the intake manifold was leaking, and was probably getting worse. No water/anti-freeze showing in the engine oil, or the lifer valley. With this being just an old used engine, I have decided to just remove it, and rebuild it or replace it with another engine I get rebuilt.
Wish me luck - and better time slips in the future.

engine issues...
 

Couldn't you use a cooling system leak testing pump...the kind that goes in place of the radiator cap?? As for the motor...compression and/or leak down test might give you some helpful info.

Good luck...wilma

Thanks WILMASBOYL78 - one friend had mentioned the radiator cap leak tester, and I thought about it. But this engine is far from being a really good hp maker. So I've decided to come up with a fresh engine.
This one is a used standard bore 2-bolt main block with some used standard bore L-78 pistons from a different engine in it. That is not the best condition for making power.

Sounds like you got a back yard mutt build. Who knows what heads and cam too.
I agree, build an engine with modern technology and know what you have. The dome on those L78 pistons are antiques in the modern engine world. Most builders want flat or very little dome to achieve a zero deck height. Hydraulic, roller cams can perform better than the old school stuff too. 600 hp on pump gas is not uncommon.