Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

You've got 'em, ............. right here.

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

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https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gifPlease Dont make me Scan copies of my automobile performance Magazine collection from the early 1970's that point clearly to the advent of Emission controls and unleded Gas with the production effect of lowered compression ratios and loss of HP.


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Please don't scan your old car magazines! Don't! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif

Once again, you're only looking at what you want to look at. Insurance was the beginning of the end. By 1970, consumers were being penalized by the insurance industry for having a 4-speed tranny, never mind that it was behind a 318 Barracuda! And all you have to do is look at the sales of many musclecars from 1970 and see how they fell drastically from 1969 . . . the Road Runner fell by more than half. The GTO probably fell 40%. Yet we consider 1970 the high point? That ball was already rolling by the time all manufacturers lowered their compression in 1972. Plus, if you look at some cars from 1971-2, you'll see that the Chevelle SS included small blocks, the GS became one model line, the 4-4-2 downgraded to a base 350, the Road Runner offered a small block for the first time . . . hell, the standard 'Cuda engine was a 318! These moves were done to increase the appeal of cars that had a strong image but owners were not willing to pay severe surcharges by the insurance industry.

Suggesting emissions is the real reason is really not telling the whole story . . . and if you know anything about Pontiacs, emissions was a poor excuse not to drop into the 13s from the showroom floor. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/burnout.gif

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The zenith was reached in late '74 for the 1975 models with the Catalytic converter which caused GM to decide to drop the Z/28. Not a darn thing to do with insurance rates as the cars were selling strong in 1974.

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You're TOTALLY wrong. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/scholar.gif

For one thing, you're making it seem that cleaner air is such a bad thing. The problem with the regulation was that it didn't give the engineers enough time to develop the equipment without hurting performance so much.

But, by 1974, many performance cars were not selling as well as before. The Barracuda/Challenger and Javelin died after 1974. But the Camaro Z/28? Sales were poor in 1972 (partly due to a strike) but production increased through 1974 after the LT-1 was banished. If the demise of the Z is due to emissions, how do you explain the continuation of the 400 and 455 Firebirds, Plymouth Road Runners, Corvettes, and 360 Dusters?

So, in other words, no need to get out your magazines . . . all you need is this site. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

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Look,.....more stringent emission standards were enevitable, but I think it would have been wiser to see if GM could at least survive and produce a vehicle that the American people would buy before putting an added burden on the car companies with untimely overstrigent emission requirements.

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Agreed 110%.

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

442...

Here is a great article that you should read: http://kotorimagazine.com/index.php?news=194

Here is a key quote:

"For many historians 1972 marked the death of the United States automotive industry. Safety features and fuel economy regulations strangled an industry already hurting from foreign imports and consumer tastes. That was the same year we re-elected Richard M. Nixon as president. It was also the last year someone walked on the moon. Coincidence? This was the death of our self-identity and our progress. That was what killed the auto industry, and in turn America. It was a death at the hands of stagnation and a culture that cared less about art and science and more about stuff."


Really now... Please do not make me get the 1975 issue of Car craft out where the headline "King Kong is alive and well on Long Island" where the Goverment came after Poor Joel Rosen on Emissions violations and put him out of the supercar business all for building V8 vegas.

Joel Rosen was running a speed shop.

We have done this all before. If we do not learn from history we are doomed to repeat it.

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

442... On the Z-28 and 1974... you are twisting things quite a bit. The demise of the Z-28 in its original "Special Hi-performance engine" designation as an option on a standard Camaro was due to regulations and GM's inability to meet the new requirements without further diminishing performance. The option was reserrected in 1977 at mid year as a handling package RPO. The 1974 cancellation was 100% due to emissions.

Chevrolet officials went on record in 1974 and said so.

This is part of the factual record from this period.

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

Just remember.....

THE NEW RED IS GREEN

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

Diego, Where did you get this info " By 1970 comsumers were penalized by ins. co. for having a 4-speed" Just what SH## house wall did you read that one on. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif No VIN# showed if the car had a 4-speed or not back then. I have NEVER asked that question to anybody in the last 36 as a Ins. agent. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

Kim, this was in a buff magazine from 1970. I suspect a company would want more than a VIN to know what they were insuring, especially considering the engine code is not in the VIN.

But 36 years is not quite 1970, eh? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif

I'll get back to the others later . . . thanks for the interesting entertainment (I mean that seriously, not in a condescending manner). https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

We asked for the vin # only. Did then, still do. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Bye Bye To The American V-8...
 

Here's an interesting read that I just ran across...apparently, the 42mpg standard ain't as far off as we initially thought:

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/05/22/e...-enough-to-dr/

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Cliff notes:

There are miles per gallon... and then there are miles per gallon. How do you tell the difference? One is labeled "CAFE mpg" and the other is labeled "EPA mpg." What's the difference? Well, Edmunds is taking pains to illuminate the large discrepancy that exists between the two figures: the issue ....

The change meant that when a customer bought a car that listed 26 combined mpg (EPA) on the window sticker, the CAFE mpg rating for that car remained at around 35 mpg.

....

""a vehicle that scores an EPA combined rating of 29 miles per gallon actually contributes 39 MPG to its manufacturer's CAFE average. There are 29 car models and 36 truck models that already achieve the new standard, and about a third of the cars and half of the trucks are produced by a domestic automaker.""

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