Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

Guys, thanks for the compliments on the black car. Les, good to hear you made it home. Are your arms still tired from waving that check at me for a week? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

Les hit the nail on the head, cars need to be within range of comparable sales. For exceptional cars, like the green W30, a strong premium is expected. IMHO, a car like that, with the history it has, can be worth twice what a similar car that is restored or more of an "average" car. Also, the most important option on these cars today is COLOR. I love the exterior color, but, the interior color is not to my taste. In 1970, it was likely the coolest! But for every one guy like me, there is likely one guy like Belair who loves it.

The most expensive 1970 W30 I have seen sell was a black 4 speed car around 100k. I just watched a matched PAIR of bright yellow 1970 W30 cars, both numbers matching frame-off restored cars, both original yellow cars, one Hardtop and one Convert , from the same family, sell at Mecum's auction for $166k for the PAIR. Which in my mind puts the convert around 110-120k and the HT at 46-56k.

Again, no disrespect intended for the car in question or the seller. It is a magnificent car with incredible history. If it is something that needs to be sold, I would suggest a price substansially lower. If you need to sell something I see no point in scaring potential buyers away. Price it a little over what your bottom line is and get it done. Just my opinion.

Now you have four cents worth of opinion from 2 guys who are famous for paying too much for cars! LOL

Colin

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

Hey guys. Thanks for the input, and also for the observations regarding the car and price.

It was not my intention to ignite a debate on the methodology used in establishing prices for musclecars. But since this discussion seems to be continuing along, maybe I should chime in with some additional thoughts...

Most of you have mentioned using comparables in establishing value, and thus selling price. I agree -- but that's the whole point -- there ARE NO comparables. There aren't any other one family-owned, Jade Green, 1970 W-30's out there with documented 18k original miles. This seems to be the ONLY ONE.

A situation in which no comparables exist then must rely on other principles to dicate price. So let's briefly reflect back to our college Economics 101 course...

The term "price" as used in economics always refers to the RELATIVE price of the item. Economics emphasizes relative price because the behavior of buyers and sellers depends on relative, not absolute, prices.

Markets are composed of buyers and sellers. A demand curve shows what buyers wish to purchase at various prices, and a supply curve shows what sellers wish to sell at various prices. The point at which these two curves intersect dictates selling "price."

In this case, the supply curve is essentially not a curve at all -- it's a single point, because there seems to be only ONE of these cars in existance. As such, "price" is established only by demand. Because this particular car is fairly desirable, there is a reasonably strong demand, which quickly pushes the price quite high.

Example: The 1962-1964 Ferrari GTO. There were only 39 produced, so again, supply isn't really a curve at all, it's a fixed constant. This particular car is extremely desirable, which means the demand curve is very steep. Thus, the car changes hands these days for anywhere between $8-$12 million. Is this "price" reasonable? Is this car THAT much better than any other car on the planet? That's certainly arguable. But again, none of that matters. The only thing that matters is the "relative price." In other words, the amount a buyer is willing to pay a seller who controls one of a very limited supply. And if one buyer is not willing to pay enough, there is another buyer eager to replace that buyer at a higher relative price. There's your demand curve.

Basically, this is just a fancy way of saying that price IS relative. In this case, the seller (my ill father) is the sole party in control of the supply. He has a relative price in mind, and it's a high one due to a 35 year bond that has formed between him and this car, and due to the fact that there aren't many other cars on the planet RELATIVE TO HIM that are more desirable than this one. If a buyer comes along who agrees, then a relative price will be established, and the car will sell. If not, then it won't sell, and dad will be happy that he still owns his prized gem.

Colin -- You hit the nail on the head. You said, "If it's something that NEEDS to be sold..." The car does not NEED to be sold. As some of you may have noted, I have other cars for sale as well, which will aid our situation. Yes, of course dad would be happy if it sold at this price. But if it doesn't, he'll still own it, which will also make him happy. So either way, he's happy. And basically, as I look at this poor man who can no longer walk, relies on huge doses of morphine for pain control, who had a stroke during his last 8 hour surgery, and who currently faces another 12 hour long surgery that the doctor is afraid to peform because he questions whether it's survivable... Hey, I ain't gonna argue with the man. I only want him to be happy for his remaining days. If he's happy, I'm happy.

I hope this rambling post will shed a bit more insight on what is obviously a difficult situation. Thanks for reading, and thanks for the well-received sentiments many of you have expressed. Much appreciated.

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

Jay, good luck with the sale. While in my last post I did refer that the asking price is a lot of "Java", I can understand your plight. Just something to put in the back of your head though and it may not apply - if your Dad is a Military "Veteran" did you study the feasibility of him getting help at a Local VA. They are not what they used to be !!! I used one when I came back from Vietnam for outpatient service since I had no medical coverage then, and the care was great. More recently, I placed my father in one several years ago. They not only saved his life after being mis-diagnosed at the local hospital , He got the best Medical attention around. With the atmosphere what it is today the Gov't is paying more attention to the Veterans at the Hosptials, and not just the Combat related injuries. Any way, good luck, hope ya get a bidding war and sell it for 500k.

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

something doesn't feel right about this thread.....

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

While I am not a party to the final transaction on the pair of Yellow W30s sold, it was my understanding that a dealer purchased the cars for resale and paid a substantial buyers premium on the $166,000.00.

While both cars had solid history and were represented as original drivetrains only the Coupe had docs.

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

My understanding is the convert was a auto trans car and had the orig trans with it's tag. Supposedly the code on that tag is W30 only. I'm no Olds expert but I would have owned either of those cars...

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

I'm with you on that one.I had no doubts the car was real. It is well known in the local Olds community. You are correct about the tag. But, they have been reproducing those for quite some time.

The point I was trying to make is that the cars were a relative bargain and didn't have all the docs the one advertised here does. Those were not record sales for the quality of cars presented.

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

The yellow 442 W-30 pair are at Happycarz now. $145k for the Convertible and $75k for the Hardtop.

http://www.happycarz.com/view_invent...p?type=muscles

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

The aluminum rear axle housing (very unique) and cover,on the convertible, had an increased capacity for fluid in a lighter pkg.

Re: FS: 1970 Olds 442 W-30, with 18,324 orig miles
 

Hey guys, a status update...

In the last month or so, I've spoken with several folks from this forum. Good people here, and I've enjoyed getting to know some of you.

Dad's heading to NYC next week to meet with a specialist, and his surgery will likely follow about a month or so later. So I'm just about ready to begin getting a bit more aggressive with the sale.

I've received several offers, and thus far the highest is $150k from a very credible buyer with known credentials.

If any of you are interested at a price above $150k, but below $350k, we should probably talk. Shoot me an email or give me a call.

Thanks again. I really appreciate everyone's feedback, and also the opportunity to promote our car on this great web site.