Jason, I am going to learning how to paint on my old truck under an open-air car port where temp control is not possible. Can you give me some input on painting when temps vary?

The car port will be shoddily sealed with thick plastic wrap, and I might use some plywood to make fake walls....maybe.


I am obviously not a pro, am not going to get fantastic results...this I realize. Thank you very much.

Well I'm not a pro just a hobbyist in my eyes. You have multiple variables against you right away. The temperature plays a key factor on what materials you purchase. Reducers have a temperature range usually 10 -15 degrees. If the outside temperature is going to vary that much you will have issues. As for the open car port ventilation is very important and not to mention bugs dirt and dust. I would talk to your local auto body supply store and ask them what reducers and paint would they recommend for your situation. I'm here to tell you paint supplies are very expensive and to just practice with them in these conditions would be wasting your money. I'm all for trying things on your own but you will be learning the hard way for sure at a very hefty price. For a very inexpensive base coat, clear and hardeners I bet you will have at least 500.00 in color and clear. When you go with inexpensive base coats usually it takes twice the amount of paint to cover. What you are looking at in the pictures I posted is one of the best clears PPG produces and high end PPG base coat DBC. For clear and base coat for this car it cost just shy of 2300 dollars. That's my cost with a discount. Retail its just shy of 3K.

With all that being said and your still willing to go this route have at it. There's no better job satisfaction than doing it yourself. The question you need to ask your self is what are my expectations of the final result.

Thanks for letting me use your thread to bounce questions around in.

I really think my first line of business should be to find a way to create a cleaner and ventilated environment first. Secondly I'll need to plan for doing this at one time, instead of trying to do it over multiple days where the temp/humidity can vary.

Thanks again Jason!

----I have a number of friends that are able to rent a booth from someone they know. Get all the prep work done 1st. Maybe that's a possibility?......Bill S

Headliner is in, doors are hung. Just received the motor from the machine shop last night. Picked up the transmission this past weekend, everything is starting to come together. Also ordered a complete glass kit that should be in next week.

The motor has been installed. The owner wanted aluminum heads. Little did he know the edelbrock heads must be a little wider because both headers needed modifications to fit. First problem was on the driver side. The header was hitting the brake line distribution block. I had to move it back and up to get it away from the heat of the header. Next was the Zbar it’s going to be real close won’t know until I get the pedals back into the car and engage the clutch. The passenger side header had to be dimpled where the lower control arm bolt head is. These Doug headers are a tight fit this for sure!

Are those headers designed for the Edelbrock heads? Those heads have their own unique port layouts from what I recall.

Yes these are the correct Doug’s headers for these heads. Some special D port head I guess. All I know is everything is tight.

How does the radiator sit in the core support for a 70 GTO? I can't remember if there were tabs off the core support that the radiator sits in? All I have are some rubber bushings. Also how does it attach at the top? With a panel? I've tried searching on the internet to see if I can find some pictures but I'm coming up empty handed.

The radiator fits into the shroud and then the shroud is bolted to the core support.

For what it's worth, that is how it's done on the Firebirds. I haven't done an A body, though.

First, the fan has to be out of the car. With the radiator and shroud on the ground, you set the radiator on the two rubber cushions at the bottom of the shroud, which engage the edges of both radiator tanks. There will also be two more rubber cushions that go in the same spot on the tank edges at the top of the radiator. Then carefully lower the shroud and radiator into place aligning up to the radiator support. There should be two or more bolts that hold the bottom of the shroud against the back side of the radiator support. There will also be a row of bolts across the top that go through the shroud into the top of the radiator support at the edge. The top bolts require the captured nut clips.

AHH that makes sense now. When I pulled the car apart the original fan shroud was broken and I tossed it. I have another shroud from another car and haven't put the 2 together yet. It all makes sense now. Thanks for the replys

1970 gto
 

Just stopped by to say the Goat looks great dude, nice work!!!!!!

How about some pics after a weekend of assembly?

I will post some pictures in a couple of days. I've been beating myself up the last couple days trying to work around these headers. Who would think one little change in the engine bay by adding aftermarket heads would create so many problems. From brake lines, alternator and power steering brackets to the clutch return spring. I have the brake lines all made and test fit. I ordered the power brake booster and that showed up damaged. We just can't win. I had to get creative with the clutch return spring. I made two brackets and both failed. Just no room for the clutch return spring or a bracket. I kept walking away from the problem and then the third attempt was the best and simplest design. I think it will work. I'm currently installing the sound deadener and rug in-between working on the engine bay. You would think final assembly would be bolt on and go, but that isn't always the case. These pictures are during mock up I will be painting the bracket and starter. Oh YA and I still need to come up with a way to get the wires to the starter, as the header tube is in the way where the original wire channel was run. That's going to be another fun challenge. I guess that's why its called hot rodding.

Did this car have the 400 starter wires running down the tube between the #5 and 7 cylinders? That won’t work with headers. You can use the 455HO/SD455 wire routing which runs across the intake, down the front of the block, behind the power steering pump and along the oil pan rail. It uses a different metal tube to protect the wires on the front of the block. You will need a starter heat shield by the way.

Is there so many problems just to add headers or the problems are increased by also using Aluminum heads?

Pure Stock is the way to Rock :-)

Ryan

Steve that is correct. I will look into that tube for the 455, do they reproduce it? Is the heat shield factory? Not that it matters but if I can install one it might save the starter.

These are Edelbrock aluminum heads and must be wider than the originals putting the headers close to the frame rail. Only Dougs make these headers for these heads they have a D shaped exhaust port. I have a friend with a 69 Chevelle with a 454 and headers and he has all sorts of space around the frame rails.

Not a lot of people go with headers on Pontiac engines for this very reason. Bad fit and big leaks, and not much more performance than the ram air manifolds give. They usually upgrade to the factory ram air manifolds which are reproduced now. They even make them with larger port flange sizes. That’s what I have in the Gramma car.

The front mounted 455HO metal tube is really just to prevent chafing on the front of the block so it’s really not that necessary on a modified car. The harness can be protected in other ways. The solenoid heat shield is reproduced in the aftermarket. I can post some photos later when I get home.

Thanks for the info Steve, it is truly appreciated. I will search for the heat shield. Good to know about the ram air exhaust manifolds. This wasn't my call all on the owner. I just get stuck trying to make this mess work.

Here's some links to the various heatshields. Since it's not a restoration it can be any style. But you have to have one on a Pontiac with headers or ram air manifolds. (a Chevy heatshield wont work since it's on the opposite side of the car)

https://www.firebirdcentral.com/1967...p/enc-2040.htm

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...ywordSearchCmd

On the Gramma car, I used the factory solenoid shield. You can also use the entire heatshield wrap for added protection. The more protection, the less the problem (Pontiacs with headers and/or ram air manifolds are notorious for cooking starters).

Here's a photo of the factory style heatshield on the Gramma car with ram air manifolds. See how close that manifold is to the solenoid?

And also here's a shot of the bracket that routes the factory starter wiring on the Gramma car.

The protection tube at the front of the engine was used to keep the positive battery cable away from the front of the exhaust manifold. You can find alternate methods to do that on a modified car. From this photo you can see the starter wires running down the front of the cylinder head and block, then it goes along the pan rail, under the motor mount and up from underneath to the starter solenoid.

Thanks again Steve.

See, it would be soooo much easier if you painted my Gramma's car...I just need the body done. You can leave all the rest to me. :-)

It may be possible I just have 3 cars to complete first. LOL Working 45HRs a week at my full time job and 10-20hours a week in my garage has been catching up to me that's for sure. I will keep plugging along.

Getting closer and closer! Waiting for the double pumper fuel line to finish the fuel line.

A couple questions on the a-body clutch and brake pedals. Is the clutch pedal supposed to be about 2" higher than the brake pedal? Does the rod from the booster belong in the bottom hole of the brake pedal? If it's in the top hole it looks like it will bind. I know the nova clutch pedal is up a little from the brake pedal but not this much.

Clutch is higher sitting than brake pedal based on what the adjustment is. Here's a photo of my old T/A. Brake rod appears to be parallel to the support bracket and straight shot back, from the master cylinder. Photo from the SD455 with automatic. ( I don't know if the pedal assembly is different in an F-body. This one does not have a hole but instead has a stud where the rod's "banjo" end attaches with a retaining clip)

Thanks Steve,

The automatic pedal I have from the parts car which had the power brake option used the bottom hole. I read some where last night on the web, for the manual brake cars both pedals would be equal and disk brake cars the brake and clutch pedal would be offset. I guess the manual brake cars would use the top hole because its a straight shot to the master cylinder and the power brake cars would use the bottom hole as the booster is slightly angled. I was just trying to get confirmation on this. I actually never noticed this until I read it last night.

I just about have all the mechanical tasks done. I'm moving onto the quarter and door glass and interior panels. I still have to bleed the brakes. The owner has decided he wants AC. The factory AC box is out just no room for it. It looks like I will have to go with a vintage air set-up. They don't make a direct replacement for the GTO I have to use a universal model. Has anyone ever used the vintage air set up?

Looks good,and well done.

The holes used on the pedal for power versus non-power is also a leverage/force thing. Years ago the shop I was at had a manual brake Firebird that wouldn't hardly stop no matter how hard you stood on the brake pedal. Simply switching to the proper mounting hole for manual brakes fixed the issue.

Looking for a pair of black seat belts. I need 2 sets male and female. Ok if they are faded I will dye them chrome on the male side should be presentable.

I ordered a ground wire kit for the GTO 3 wires one goes from the head on the passenger side to the firewall the other from the front passenger floor mount to the frame. Where does the third ground wire go?

Once again, from a F-body perspective instead of A-body, but the Gramma car has a third, heavy gauge ground wire running from the passenger side subframe rail to a bellhousing bolt near the oil filter housing

Wow never seen that on a car Steve. These are just 3 braided copper wire lines

I asked a friend of mine who know 69 GTO's and he said there is a ground strap that goes from the passenger side inner fender to the front of the frame somewhere.

may be different on a 70?

thanks I will look on the inners

Waiting on the dash from Just Dashes. Vintage air all installed I just have to charge the system. Hood and nose will be going on it this week.