Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

I think the last 2 posters get it!

Patrick

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

[ QUOTE ]
I am71 years old and forteanite to own a1969 Yenko Camaro. No amount of money will buy this car. It is my living will to go to my son, and from him to my grand dauther. So I know that it will be in the familey for quite some time. So you see not all of us are in to this for the money. We also have 4 more 69 camaros, not for sale.

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https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
No amount of money will buy this car. It is my living will to go to my son, ................. So I know that it will be in the familey for quite some time. So you see not all of us are in to this for the money.

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https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

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X 10!!!! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

I make no bones about my car being a beater. In the 12 years that I've had the car, I've put about $15k into it to keep it that way. I have also put about 8000 miles on it.
I am pretty sure that it will be the least detailed car on display at the SCR. It is also in my will to my step-son.
To each his own.
There are tons of late 2nd and early 3rd gen Camaros that can be had for cheap $.
As they say: "Don't crush 'em, restore 'em". https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Sorry about the spell'ing on my post.Should have used spell-check. Old fingers sometimes don't do what the brain tells them to do.

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

It's true. You get it or you don't. The fact that the old cars drive like old cars is the mystique to owning one!!

I go for a spin in my restored 74 CJ5 w the 304-V8 and I am smiling the entire time!! It is a blast to drive!! Yes the suspension is stiff, yes the steering wheel is big and not balls on acurate, yes it has a nice rumble to it, no it has no a/c, no there are no bells whistles or gizmos.... and that is why it is an awosome vehicle to drive!!!!! I will never sell it!! My future son or daughter will own this Jeep!!

Now, that being said, do I think a 69 Zl-1 should cost a million. Hell no. You cannot compare a Camaro to a Dusenberg or a Bugatti. Nope, no way. These were hand built limited production (not just engine but body or marque for that matter) borderline works of art.

Hey, I think the Zl-1 or a COPO or a Yenko is an awsome thing!! Jaw drops when I see on in person, goosebumps when I hear a wide open throtle pass!! But to justify the ultra high values?? I am afraid it is similar to when speculation ran rampant through the Ferrari market in the late 80's early 90's. A lot of speculation, a lot of money chasing the same cars creates an ersatz market. It is not sustainable.

Just my lil ole .02 worth!

King Midas.... I agree the old ones do not drive nearly as "nice" as the new ones... so what do you like about them??

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

[ QUOTE ]
I want more rust! When is the last time you heard someone say that? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/wink.gif

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Is it too late to buy your old 72 back https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/confused.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

I miss it. But it is in good hands. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/frown.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Much of it is about "Lifestyle" and what some people can afford! Hi demand for so few quality cars. Its that simple.

If you think musclecar prices are insane. How about taking a 30 day "Exotic Hunt" for Lion in Botswana. You still have time to make a reservation for the 2007 season. It will only run you $139,150 for 30 days! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/crazy.gif If you can't quite spring for a lion. That's O.K. How about $58,250 for an Elephant instead. For those of you who are wondering. The average tusk weight is 60 pounds. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/crazy.gif

Maybe we should stop analyzing the market and let it be! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

And no I have no intention of shooting a lion anytime soon.

Patrick

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

As I get older and older and attend more car shows and cruises I see a decline in the younger crowd. While we have 4 sons, one being a mechanic and in the National Guard, NONE of them are really car guys! Not that they don't like them but not interested in owning big dollar cars. Our boy that just got back from Iraq is still working part time at Buxmont Truck Accessories. Anybody around his age 27 is buying 4WD's or very few buy Mustangs. Actually you can buy almost perfect 1998-2000 corvettes for 25,000 that will dust anyone of those cars and not even hear it running. They are not to interested in our type of cars like I have NO interest in a model A or T. That is why they fell off the earth. All those collectors are gone. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/frown.gif I believe the prices for the big number cars will be still high down the road, (Hemis, ZL1's etc.) They are going to be harder to sell. If you didn't grow up with the car it is hard to get REAL interested in paying 65,000 for a fairly nice Z/28. Especially when the COPO's and such are never driven anymore they will loose interest in the younger group. Those kids don't even see these cars if they don't go to the big shows. Heck, Most of the rice burners eat our cars up anyway. I will NOT allow those cars to park in my driveway and my kids know it. Our kids range from 29-21 in age and I can't see any of them paying 100,000 or even 75,000 for a car they can't or don't want to drive. So in closing most of these crazy priced cars will be buried with their baby boomer owners. So get out there and drive em if you have em! You may be the last generation to do so.https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/headbang.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Here's an idea - buy your boy a muscle car https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

I bought Benjamin the '69 Nova SS when he was just 1, now he's almost 5 and knows full well that it's his car. If this doesn't work - then I don't know what will, and Slammies prediction will come true https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/shocked.gif

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h6...aminandSS2.jpg

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

[ QUOTE ]
It is my living will to go to my son, and from him to my grand dauther.

[/ QUOTE ]

How old is your grandaughter and is she single? .
Please send pics....of the Yenko! .

Just kidding of course....still love to see pics though!
https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif
~ Pete

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

I am praying that M is right. At least he got the kid on the right track! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/burnout.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ins/3gears.gif There will always be straglers here and there but for the most part......... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif I am just not to sure that Benjamin or any of my kids will lay out $150,000+ on one of these Yenkos like this generation did. They are going to be like our parents who were farmers. Once the farm got turned over to us bang!!! for sale and subdivide. Nowwww we can buy a Yenko! Thanks mom and dad. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

IMO, if the kids of the future aren't into the cars you are into, its your own fault for not getting them involved. I'm 31 and my brother is 27, and we were both brought up with classic chevy's all around us. My dad took us to swap meets, car shows, showed us how things worked on old cars, how to fix stuff, and how to drive one. My dad never had any Yenko's or Motion's, just your basic musclecars... but it was enough to get us into it, and to be honest, I'm now more into these "old cars" more than my dad ever was. While he doesn't eat, sleep, and breathe all things Yenko like I do, he gave me the spark that got my juices flowing for these cars, and its something that will be with me forever. When I was 15 he helped me buy a 400.00 rusty old 72 Nova, and showed me how to fix it up, from the engine to the interior, to the paintjob. That experience not only got me the coolest car in high school, but it got me hooked on the car hobby for good. This whole process was repeated a few years later with my younger brother and the 70 Chevelle he still owns to this day.

I have no kids, but if and when I do, you can bet they will get the same kind of insight, understanding, (and hopefully interest) in the cars I am into, just as I did when i was a kid. ADULTS, and especially parents are the most influential people to kids, regardless of if they'll admit it or not. I teach Kindergarten through 5th grade, and see over 750 kids each week for just 35 minutes at a time, but even at that, alot of them now know what a Camaro looks like, what a Yenko is, and how to tell a 67 from a 68. As the saying goes, "take a kid to a car show." get them involved and interested, like Marlin is doing with his young son. Trust me, they'll get hooked for life just like the rest of us.
https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/flag.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

I have my son on the right track also he is seven and loves to go to the shows and cruises with me. He loves corvetts. But as he gets older he is starting to know all the gm cars. I hope to restore a car with him too some day. I share the same opinion as SC69sam. I have friends that are into old car but very few. I started to notice it at shows and swap meets 75% of the people that are walking around looking at the cars are older than me. I kinda started this post to get everyones opinion. I will always love old cars and enjoy working on them. I would rather work on my old car than my every day driver. I hope the hobby keeps on growing and I will start saving my penny's for a Yenko nova.

Jason

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Took them to the drags and car shows for years. Even took them to the Ford nationals at Maplegrove a few times. Big Foot was there. Like I said, its not that they don't like cars and that stuff it is just they would not buy the cars from my era for that kind of money. They are more into trucks and SUV's. Don't worry Joe I take my little grandaughters all over with me and their parents do bring them to the car shows I enter. Just don't know how long that lasts though. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Wait till you get some kids....easier said than done! Schonye is lucky! Hey it may skip a generation and the grand kids may get all my stuff! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif P.S. My dad was not into cars but I have oil for blood so don't always know how it will work but you are correct about exposure! Take em with you. Look at Caleb!!!

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

My Dad is not into cars at all, he just sort of shakes his head at me https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Schonye is lucky! Hey it may skip a generation and the grand kids may get all my stuff! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif
Not if I can help it! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif
Joe (the next in line)

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

I agree with Marlin and Joe 100% My son is 2 y.o.a. He goes to school every day (approx. 7 mile one way trip) in a '68 SS 396 Chevelle with open headers. He is mad when for some reason we have to use my wife's Trailblazer. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Open headers!! Ever give yourself a ticket? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif Good one Sam! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

The older brothers line up at my house when I was about 12-13;
68 400 firebird 4spd
66 421 tripower catalina ( given to my older brothers for free)
68 428 Mustang
70 428 Cougar

and my Dad telling me how he had to change an engine in a 40 Ford Convertible around 1954, did it in an hour using a couple of chains and the oak tree in our front yard. car ran great, loaded up 4 of his friends, drove to Nebraska from Long Island for the helluva it, oh yea, the covertible had no top, just the frame, nobody cared... That did it for me SULLY

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

As far as great value in terms of Camaro's, you cannot go wrong with the 98-02 LS1 cars. Huge performance per dollar, good looks and mileage. The 99 model shown below ran mid thirteen's stock, presently high 11's @ 116 mph with mild mods and still knocks down 20 mpg in combined city/highway driving, and the car is worth about $8-$9K in its present condition.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y86...6/DSCN4819.jpg

My other two Camaro's are pretty far back in terms of performance, handling, braking, and mileage. But what appeals to me are the way they make me feel. The rough idle, unburned exhaust fumes, styling, rarity, ease of working on, and so so ride and handling appeal to me because it brings me back to my youth. Driving these cars and the reaction I get brings me back to my 20's when they were commonplace and no one cared if they had the proper date coded block or transmission. All you wanted to do was go fast and look cool doing it. Now, there is a desire inside of me that wants to restore and preserve these cars so that future generations can experience the fun that these cars bring. And for that, people are willing to pay top dollar for these cars now.

Paul

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Dollars to donuts most kids my kids age will take your 11 second camaro for 10,000. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/wink.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Hey Sam, I know the less "traveled" paths to take! Besides I never write tickets for loud pipes. In Louisiana we have a "Loud Pipes Save Lives" program. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ins/tongue.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Somebody wake up Belair. We need a little "Willie the wimp, and his cadillac coffin", by Stevie Ray. Mine's all goin with me. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif
And yes Sam. It's nice to have your own in house painter. To bad he'll have to wait until I'm gone to claim to be the best. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/rolleyes.gif
Nice to see you post Mr. Shockly. Always good to visit with you. Hope you're doing well. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

You are a funny man! I like the loud pipes philosophy. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

my.02
1) Most prices are balooned way out of proportion right now.
2) The regular enthusiast people who own these cars for anything other than an investment wouldn't or couldn't pay the dollars it takes to buy them right now, those enthusiast people are mostly currently "sellers or keepers".
3) Once the "investment interest" moves on to something else, and there is a new "status symbol" for the rich, prices will drop. Right now muscle cars are the flavor of the week.
4) Any substantial increase in interest rates and the prices will start to drop out of the muscle car movement.
5) The prices of clone cars is an indication how far out of reality the prices are right now. Who pays 100k for a car you can build for 35??
6) If you need a yardstick to measure this by, just look at what happened to the hot rod market. A car that a few years ago would top a couple hundred grand now stumbles to fetch 75k. True, the good cars maintain "a value" of some kind, but there isn't the "status quo" inflation on them that there was.
7)Muscle car prices in general will go down. its just a matter of time, I give it less than 5 years for the first drop to prices with both the most expensive cars, and the lowest valued cars taking the largest hits first.
Mark.

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

well Let me tell you a story,
I have 4 daughets and the two oldest asked to go to the first school dance a few years back.So I told them they could go if I drive them with my 70 chevelle ss l78 4 speed.
Well they alost swallowed their tongue at the thought of them arriving at the parking lot dance in this old chevelle"
However they finaly reluctanly agreed. Friday night came they got all dooled up and I got the Chevelle ready to go.
The school was only a short distance away and I arrived at the parking lot in 1st gear (m22) to make all the noise The car could muster. Drove right up to the crowd and stopped.
All the Youg 13 year olds about 200 of them. boys imedialy left their girlfriends standing on the dance floor and ran towards the fire breathing Chevelle. As the ladies got out they were deluged with popularity and the boys were amazed that their dad drove such a car.
The next dance came along and they could not wait to have me take them again.
So much for the youg not loving the muscle cars.The only thing that concerns me is the price of such cars most of them will only be able to dream about owning one.

https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gifPeter

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Interesting predictions. However. I'll wait to see what this market looks like (especially for Hemi-E bodies, Yenkos, Copos and some of the other rare Super Cars) after the new Challenger and Camaro are back for the next "muscle Car" bonanza! That will surely bring alot more buyers into this arena! Just my prediction.

Patrick

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Yes... I am 44yrs old and I remember the days back when I was a teenager,and I first lived, ate and slept muscle cars, my very first car was a 1965 malibu ss I bought from the original owner in 1976.. people thought I was stupid for fixing up old worn out cars, but appreciated them when I was done..
I am a muscle car guy, have been all these years, and I like to own muscle cars because I like the way they look, I like the way they feel,and I appreciate the historical significance of them.
Fortunately, I still have a muscle car purchased prior to the price hikes. Unfortunately, I would never be able to justify spending the money it would take to buy some of the other muscle cars I would have liked to own...Actually, I couldn't justify spending the money to buy the one I already have if I didn't already own it.
That is the sad part about what the prices do to the hobby. It takes the cars out of the hands of those who appreciate the cars for what they are, not for what they are worth.
Mark. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/frown.gif

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Someone asked what I like about the old stuff-- Uhh, get my hands dirty a few times a month; go to the garage, smoke a few cigarettes and drink some beer, and hang out. Maybe take a drive once a month when work and responsibility don't have the golden handcuffs on me. Fun a couple of times a month should not cost me $75K, which doesn't include garaging, parts, GAS (yikes!), etc... Doesn't quite seem worth it to me...

But, in reality, it goes even further than the stupid prices and non-drivability factor... I think the kids of today simply think that old people hoarding parts and treating them like idiots have caused them (the kids) to do their own thing. And maybe even out of spite, they purposefully steer clear of all things SS and v-8. Put simply, they have the choice to buy Mustangs, Camullets, and Corvettes-- Late models are priced similarly to the hot imports... But, they don't buy those cars. They're not interested. Even futher, they're flying their own flags, and that's that.

If you guys were smart, you'd all start buying early '70's imports, like BMWs, Porsches, VWs, Datsuns and Toyotas... Those cars are cheap, fun, modern construction, and the kids are all into modifying heritage cars of what they drive and hotrod today. I said it first-- King Midas, the Oracle.

I lived and worked through the dot-com crash, and do you know what one of the major factors was regarding the dominoes tumbling? All of those businesses were inner-connected-- They sold their stuff to each other. Once the market started to fall, they went like dominoes because they lost their business network. That is a likely analogy as to what will happen with musclecars.

And yes, my father taught me how cars worked and how to take care of them. How a cluster gear works, how to set point dwell, what abuse will break a u-joint, etc... I now know more than him, and I probably know more than some of you. But, does that mean that I'd step up to the plate to buy that 7-second '69 Z that gets 10 mpg, idles like it's mad at something, no A/C, and is akin to being in a relationship with a hot chick that you cannot trust, and though she looks great, she doesn't really run or handle all that well. Maybe if she were priced under $10K and you could actually have fun with it on a budget... At present prices, it's the old man vs. the kid-- That Z will be traded between home equity borrowers until the money runs out, and the last guy stuck with it will wear a frown.

There is still hope that I can pick up that Z for under $10K....

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

If the musclecars are not worth it to you because of cost, parts hoarders, etc. why are you on this site? There must be plenty of sites for those more interested in newer muscle. Personally I don't see the connection between overvalued "smoke and mirror financials" dot-com companies and their resulting demise and a musclecar financial collapse. The supply of vintage musclecars is not changing and their demand will remain strong for years to come. Yes with the cooling of the housing markets people will be less likely to spend discretionary income on musclecars. I would love to see a crash in musclecar values, I'd just buy more! I don't see it happening anytime soon.
Admitted car & part hoarder,
Mark

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

Another scenario may be that with the softening of the housing market, real estate investors may shift their money into muscle cars. Who knows and who cares. Mark you make a great point; why do some people who believe these cars are worthless continue to participate on a website designed for the true enthusiast. If you want to see some car fanatics, just visit the crew at this years Super Car Reunion. This is a group of diehard car guys/gals who are livin life to the fullest.

I admit getting into the market now is rather costly, but if you had been following the market over the last 5 years you could have had a rather large collection at a very reasonable cost. I bet the same people who complained about the price of cars 5 years ago are still the ones complaining today.

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

It's only money, you can't take it with you!

Re: Mecum Auction COPOs everywhere
 

I look at it this way, I have a degree in Finacial Management. I trusted the stock market up until about the year 2000. There is as much fraud going on in the stock market as there is in #'s matching documented muscle cars. If you have all your eggs in one basket you are asking for trouble. Diversification is the key, I look at muscle cars as part of my investment portfolio. Additionally, when I was a kid I was observing the peak of the horsepower wars and all I thought about was cars and sports, until a few years later when girls entered the picture. So in addition to stocks and real estate, I have some money tied up into muscle cars. I have taken hits in the stock market and will probably see my real estate values go down over the next few years. I have the cars not only because of the investment potential but because I always, since I was about 9 years old, wanted a lot of different makes and models. If I buy a car now and the market takes a hit I will be stuck with a car I really like and will enjoy driving, showing, and tinkering with it for a long time. Those that are in it for the money better have the ability to take the loss or ride out a market correction if and when it happens. If you think this market will keep going up, up and away, you might want to reconsider. I understand there is a finite number of these cars but the pool of people who owned or wanted to own these cars is definitely getting older and they or their heirs will sell what they own. The $64,000 question is how long will the market continue going up, part two is how much of a correction will we see. I looked at the real estate market the last few years as an unhealthy trend that wasn't sustainable and now we are seeing the correction. Before that it was the dot com boom / bust. At this point I'm not selling my cars but I own them all free and clear. Probably the smart move to make right now is to sell the cars and poise to pick up real estate when all those interest only balloon loans start coming due. Either that or open up another damn Starbucks. My $.02 worth.