Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

I'll shoot some pics, but you'll have to wait on Uncle Sam. Damn computers.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Alan, I think if you show the judges pics of the car when you bought it new, and the ad with it showing the optional sport mirrors, and they still tell you, the original owner, they're not correct for your car, you should tell them to kiss your ass. I frickin hate it when you've owned it since day 1 and someone tells you "oh they never came that way". I applaud you for your patience.I might have had to help this gentleman put his clip board in a personal place.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif Well said! BTW,where did you get the hood scoop/tach combo you are referring to?

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Wow Mayor... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

[ QUOTE ]
https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif Well said! BTW,where did you get the hood scoop/tach combo you are referring to?

[/ QUOTE ]

https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Maybe the mayor and I aren't talking about the same scoop, because the tach face sure looks like a standard 8 grand Dixco to me. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif Can't wait to see pics of it on a Deuce!
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/143...HoodScoop2.jpg
...and with all you wi$ea$$es out there, it's T -30 seconds until the caption writing contest to starts on this one. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/Charley.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Kid, I think you're right. They're not the same. What I have is different. This on came off a rebel machine. I had looked for the setup at swap meets and found a few but not complete. Was talking to Marlin about it and he mentioned he had the whole setup. So we cut the deal. I had hoped to put it on the infamous yellow/rust Pa. deuce, but that's not gonna happen. So we just cut a hole in my old yellow deuce hood and bolted it on. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

[ QUOTE ]
.... So we just cut a hole in my old yellow deuce hood and bolted it on. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]


Hum... sounds like someone is gearing up for the 2nd annual Deuce shootout at SCR8. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/haha.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ins/3gears.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

It's definitely looking like a different scoop was used on the Rebel Machine. http://clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/...rticle/one.jpg Here's a link for several other shots. Rebel Machines Now I assumed the Rebel and the Jeep Commando got the same scoops being that they were both AMCs being prepped by Hurst, but it looks like this isn't necessarily the case. Hmm... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gifthis seems to bring only more confusion. The Commando scoop looks like it has one big opening on the front, versus the split twin openings on the Rebel type, while Yenko's Deuce protoype has no opening at all and doesn't really appear to have provisions for making an opening. We may be looking at 3 completely separate tach/scoop combos here. This doesn't really clear up what Yenko used at all, I just assumed the Yenko scoop would have the Dixco type tach face being that the "regular" hood tach was a standard issue 8 grand Dixco unit...any thoughts? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

I still lean towards a prototype of some sort on the brochure car, but now I'm not sure if it's a Rebel, Jeep, or mystery Dixco prototype! Cool pics of the Jeep version though, I had never seen that version b4 https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

The tack on the AMC was a 8 grand white letters and turned to red letters at 5 to 8 grand 180 sweep. It didn't have center face on the bottom like the Jeep shows. KIm

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Has anyone considered the possibilty that the hoodscoop shown in the Deuce prototype photos is a one-off hand-made piece fabbed up at Yenko for the "mock-up" pics of the Deuce? I mean considering the fact is known the car itself was just a 6 cylinder car with blue guts, whats to say the hoodscoop itself wasnt created out of nothing... with the anticipation of later ordering the scoops from Dixco or wherever... then by the time the COPO Novas actually arrived, Don changed his mind about offering it for whatever reason, (price, availability, difficulty of install, etc.) That would explain why there were no pics taken of the backside of the hoodscoop during that publicity photo shoot, and would also explain why no one has ever seen one quite like the one in the pics... He may have had a scoop constructed in-house, based on the photos the had seen elsewhere, making his 0ne-off scoop
similar enough to what he planned to later offer, and making it "close-enough" in design to use for the B&W press photos. Just something to consider... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

The scoop being a hand fabbed mock up piece is definitely another possibility, as we know Yenko was known to "mock up" items for photo purposes before.

Warren Dernoshek has commented about at least one instance of Yenko "hanging" a set of Corvette sidepipes on a 67 Yenko Camaro with some mechanic's wire for simple photo purposes, so it's entirely possible the prototype Deuce scoop was constructed with similar intentions.

I'm still betting there's a link to Dixco lurking there somewhere, it just hasn't been uncovered yet. Time will tell...good to see there's more than one of us who cares to have this mystery sorted out. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

That's what I was thinking Joe, sort of a prototype model, and like you said - an in house prototype. This is a very viable theory, keep in mind the glass decklid with integrated spoiler for the '68 Y-Cam's! What did he make, something like 3 of them? Only installed on the first few cars, one of which was not even a copo?

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

When comparing the pics, I think the Yenko and Jeep Commando scoops look very similar, the only difference being that the Jeep has the opening "knocked out" in front.

I'm starting to doubt the scratch fabbed theory, which is why I'd love to get a close look at an original Hurst Jeep Commando scoop in person, then maybe we could determine it's manufacturer. The only problem is Hurst prepped Jeepster Commandos with their original scoops intact aren't too plentiful either.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Probably have a better chance of finding the original 6 cylinder prototype car with the hoodscoop intact... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/wink.gif Anyone know any Jeep forums where someone might be into those Commandos or possibly even have an original? Sorta gives new meaning to those bumper stickers I see that read "Its a Jeep thing, You wouldn't Understand" https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ins/tongue.gif
btw, Mayor.. I hope you're joking about wacking a hole in the original hood of your yellow deuce. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Yea, I was just kiddin about the yellow hood. We're waitin for a Grump lump for it. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif The hood we used though, did come off the other Peck deuce. It had a buckle on the center rib, so we replaced it. The buckle was where the scoop sets over, and where we cut in the flapper door.
The scoop we have, the rebel scoop, and the prototype, all look to me to be the same height. I'm not sure the openings aren't cut on the prototype. It could be the angle the picture was shot. Also looks under magnification that there is a center rib on the proto.
Anyway it all came home painted today. Probably won't match the car as the painter was sober this time. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/rolleyes.gif Will try to get it striped, and together this week, and send pics. Right, wrong, or indifferent, Don should have put some on.It looks pretty cool.
Tom, actually trying to get Jensen's done asap.May not get done for the nats, but will be for the reunion. I havn't driven anything anywhere yet this year. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/frown.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

I look forward to seeing it... I agree it will probably look pretty cool. You shoulda bought your painter a bottle of somethin' though... cheap insurance of quality work... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/wink.gif
I haven't driven anything this year yet either... and its already mid-June. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/frown.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Actually the painter is my youngest son. I gave it up a few years ago when I finally admitted he was better at it than I was. He paints at Arnold's body shop in Davenport Ia.One of the largest, independent bodyshops in the Quad cities. John Arnold the owner, is the son of Duane Arnold who was my body/paint instructor in 1971. Amazing where life takes us.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

[ QUOTE ]
I haven't driven anything this year yet either... and its already mid-June.


[/ QUOTE ]

Makes three of us.... https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/frown.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

I did...last night we loaded up and went to Rolling Meadows....PA guy announced a sever thunderstorm was hitting near Ohare airport and people left in droves so we left too...I drove directly into the storm...wasn't all that bad...wipers worked....but it stayed dry in Rolling meadows I think...shoulda stayed..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...ls/Kids010.jpg

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

We had a Hell of a Storm roll through here lastnight around 6PM.
Real rath of God like.. http://www.crh.noaa.gov/arx/images/storm.ani.gif
I was headed to Downers,then turned around with my tail between my legs.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

[ QUOTE ]
I did...last night we loaded up and went to Rolling Meadows....PA guy announced a sever thunderstorm was hitting near Ohare airport and people left in droves so we left too...I drove directly into the storm...wasn't all that bad...wipers worked....but it stayed dry in Rolling meadows I think...shoulda stayed..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...ls/Kids010.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]


God, that car is beautiful...! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/worship.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

http://www.planethoustonamx.com/part...e/70rebpr1.JPG
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/144225-machine.jpg
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/142906-ebay834.jpg
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/143...HoodScoop2.jpg
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/144225-FF54.jpg
http://www.off-road.com/jeepster/rigs/rig144.jpg
Looks to me like the Rebel and Deuce scoops aren't one in the same, but I'm still trying to determine if the Hurst applied Jeep Commando scoop is the same as Yenko's prototype Deuce. The Deuce looks like it's solid in the front, while the Commando's is open, but otherwise they look much more alike than the Rebel to Deuce. Same square angle front, same slope to the tach pod. Looks like the Commando is just Yenko's version cut open in front. Any thoughts?

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

[ QUOTE ]
dual rear spoilers

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this what you guys are talking about?

http://members.roadfly.com/jim_rohn/ccbox.jpg

NOS Cal Custom 1969 Camaro SS Z28 spoiler 442 GS AMX GT

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

I believe that is the one Jeff.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

I sent some shots to Marlin including one taken at the same angle as the proto car. From that angle it doesn't look like they're open either as you're looking into the roof of the scoop.Also the nova hood rib matches perfectly with the rebel application.
I'm not sure we'll ever know for sure which is right unless someone comes up with a through the windshield shot from the prototype. Or the prototype surfaces. Unfortunatly we can't ask Don. Rob,pm me your address. I'll send you some on the car shots.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Schoneye...we have to get you a damn digital !!!

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

I believe those are the right ones there Jeff!!
I think Schoneye needs to buy them and install them along with the scoop https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...iggthumpup.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

How are the Deuce optional sport mirrors,different from the ones used on the Hurst/Olds Cutlass?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...Gold-fa-sy.jpg

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Color

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

Upon closer inspection of a legit specimen, I've determined that the Hurst Olds mirrors are not the same as the one's Yenko used on the select Deuces. Not only do they differ in color and plating, but rather in size. The Deuce mirrors are much smaller in scale when you compare the two side by side. Not sure who manufactured either style, but the more I get to digging, the less significant the Hurst connection seems to be.

I'm fairly confident that the hood scoop used on the Jeepster Commando and the prototype Deuce are the same, whether it be out of coincidence or something more.

Outside of that, I can't think of one single item with perhaps the exception of maybe a dual gate shifter that can be confirmed the same on a Deuce and another Hurst converted vehicle.

https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

The smaller mirrors are the Talbots, but the deuces did not get those mirrors. The deuce mirrors are actually quite large in person, and we believe they also came on the Hurst rambler scramblers.

I think the jury is still out on the hood scoop. Don would not be committed to a scoop because it contained a dixco tach, he would most likely use whatever was cheapest - if any at all. For years we have wondered why Don went with the Dixco tach when he had been so committed to the SW's, the only thing we could think of was price!

The Hurst connection also involves the 4speed shifter lifted from the GTO, and the 50 cars that went to Hurst.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

You bring up an interesting point Marlin, I can't say I fully understand the Hurst shifter that was included on 4 speed equipped COPO 9010 Novas. Why necessitate the Hurst, obviously it's the superior shifter in terms of performance, but the stock Muncie unit was just fine in the '69 Chevelles & Novas, not to mention earlier Camaros etc. Is there any evidence of correspondence between Don and GM regarding the implementation of the Hurst unit? Wonder who figured out the Z/28 box and the Goat handle would work properly? There's got to be engineering docs somewhere. Kind of odd the Yenko Deuce is the only Chevrolet that wasn't a Camaro to get a factory installed Hurst shifter. Marlin your road race theory makes sense. The competition had Hurst, Don may have simply demanded it as part of the COPO. Wish we knew definitive answers to these questions. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

In discussion with Marlin about the "dual gate shifter", if I remember correctly, none got the dual gate as in console mounted like would be in Rob's camaro, or a Hurst Olds. They were all auto sticks which had a dual shift pattern on the shifter ball, and could be manualy shifted, or left in auto. There was no "gate" like most people think of. This was an aftermarket, take it out of the box, install it, never a factory piece. The term is misleading. I know of no deuces with a console mounted Hurst dual gate shifter.
Muncie shifters were never in my opinion, fine. They belonged in the same garbage can as the smog sh t. They got tossed just about as fast as exhaust manifolds. I don't know who took the time to "engineer" the deuce 4 spd shifter setup but it works great.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

You are right Eric, there doesn't seem to be a ryhme or reason to the deuce combination of options. The hood scoop from that Jeep had me convinced it was the one, until I saw the pics of rebel machine scoop on Schoneyes hood - it too looks just like the brochure pic! So, I don't know which one it is - but will admit that I never even knew about that Jeep model until you posted that pic. You told me about the Jeep model several years ago, but I never saw a picture - it's pretty convincing, but the Rebel one is too, like you said, we just don't know https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/frown.gif

The shifter situation is a somewhat more clear, thanks to a conversation I had with G.Campbell several years ago - he was the VP of the shifter plant here in Warminster, PA. The combo of the Z28 box and the GTO arm came from their engineering dept, but Campbell did not have the doc's. It's possible that Dennis Kirban has them, and may not know it, but I have not been able to obtain them as Dennis is now involved with the GN's and GNX's. It appears that the 4177 arm is the standard 'bench seat 4speed arm' as it was used on several models. So, we believe that the only unique thing is the use of the Z28 box in order to have the arm come through the center of the tunnell. But WHY? We don't know why Yenko was so intent on getting Hurst shifters in the deuces - we believe it was to keep up with the 'Jones' - the SCCA cars like the Boss302's, the Challenger T/A's and AAR's. Campbell explained that factory installed shifters in the GM cars were always 'round stock' because it was cheaper to mfg'r than the flat stock version. He said it was weaker than the flat stock version, for obvious reasons. So, we surmise that Yenko decided to opt for the 'inexpensive' factory Hurst model for the 4speed cars instead of having to install OTC versions which would be more expensive. Basically the cost of the factory installed Hurst shifter would be less than Don buying the OTC version and paying his staff to install it - they already had to install approx. 53 a/t shifters. Time consuming to say the least!

The more I study the factory SCCA cars, the more I believe that Don had the Yenko Deuce destined for that series - but he may not have been able to sell enough, which is why he attempted to get it NHRA certified. BTW, Don didn't try to get the deuce cert'd for drag racing until quite late in '70, more effort was done in '71 than '70. But, we need more info to confirm his intentions.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

I thought Marlin had mentioned before that he knew of at least one Deuce that got a '69 style Hurst dual gate auto shifter in lieu of the long handled 4 speed appearing "Super Shifter." I believe he's mentioned that a few cars were sold with their column shifters intact as well. I can't say I know of a Dual Gate equipped example personally, so I won't argue the fact. I'm still trying to learn these cars myself.

As far as the factory installed Hurst 4 speed shifter on the 4 speed Deuces is concerned, do we know for sure it was Don who was behind it's implementation? I don't doubt that the engineers at Hurst could have quickly come up with the combination of using the existing '69 Z/28 offset shifter box with a GTO bench seat handle to properly fit in a Nova configuration when they were approached with the idea, but what interests me most is who came up with the idea of including a Hurst shifter as part of the 9010 COPO package in the first place, and what special preparations were taken to make it happen at the factory.

There were no year old Hurst Z/28 shifter boxes or GTO bench seat handles laying along the line at Willow Run prior to the batch of 9010 cars coming through. Nor would there be any other Nova floor pans to be stamped with the unique 4 speed shifter hole that the hybrid Hurst set up would require, and Fisher Body would have had to be made aware of this. The big block rods and K member would have to be on hand and ready to install. There would have had to have been some sort of "briefing" of the assembly line workers prior to the batch of COPO cars coming through.

When you think about it, it just seems like a lot of extra engineering went into utilizing the Hurst shifter in the 9010 cars, not to mention a lot of extra cost. Now from Yenko's perspective it sounds like a no brainer...pay a little extra and have the cars arrive with Hurst 4 speed shifters factory installed and ready to ship, or pay a crew to switch out nearly 100 Muncie shifters with expensive over the counter Hurst units and then be stuck with the original and essentialy worthless factory Muncie units. Seems like just another part of the COPO system that Don utilized to make his life a little easier back in Canonsburg. But for the brass at GM, I'm sure a cost analysis had to be done to decide what the Hurst shifter would cost in terms of actually getting it on the cars at the factory, and whether it could be justified to be done at all. Somewhere there's got to be paperwork or documentation of some kind discussing this. I'd love to know who's at the bottom of the idea to include the Hurst at the factory, and just what it took to build the special batch of COPO cars in the middle of regular Nova production.

When it comes down to it, a Yenko Deuce is essentially everything a 70 Z/28 is just wrapped in a Nova shell rather than a Camaro. Perhaps the Hurst shifter was something Don felt was required of a performance car, and having had them installed in his 69 Camaros he may have simply demanded it as part of his COPO package. I guess we'll never know until some docs turn up. I doubt Chevrolet offered to tool up to include the shifter without some prompting from Yenko's end, but if it was solely Yenko's idea you'd think some documentation regarding it would have popped up somewhere.

I guess maybe in time something will turn up. On a side note, does anyone have an original GM window sticker for a 9010 Nova? COPO Pete? I'd be curious to see how it lists the shifter.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

You are correct again regarding the extra work for GM to put the Hurst combo in the Nova! This combo is the only non-console one to come through the center of the tunnell, and it was indeed extra work for GM. When examining the method used to put the hole in the tunnell for the deuces, it is very interesting. The hole was originally cut open with a torch, as the edges are 'burned', but the template used must not have been big enough because the forward and aft edges are 'snipped'! So, not only did they have to engineer where this hole should be, they got it wrong - ie; too small 'lengthwise', and had to open it up. All untouched tunnells are like this, and it makes you wonder why they didn't just use the shifter boot bezel as the template (that's a tip for you guys repairing your tunnells!). I wish I could go back and quiz Don about this shifter choice, but....... The BB stuff like the rods and Xmember https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif We are clueless on that one, only theories https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/smile.gif

To my knowledge there are no original GM window stickers found for the deuces, just the one that Yenko affixed. Pete has the GM of Canada info for his car, but nothing is listed regarding the shifter - just the two copo #'s. So, we believe the shifter was included with #9737, no proof - just a theory!

The a/t cars with the AutoStick vs. the Dual Gate is also interesting. We've believed that the standard auto shifter was the A/Stick, the that the optional a/t shifter was the dual gate. This optional dual gate version actually cost $80 https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/shocked.gif with the actual a/t trans costing $85! The new knowledge that we've gained is from Tommy K's a/t deuce, since it's the first window sticker we have for an a/t deuce with the a/stick - the other window sticker is for a car claimed to have the dual gate. Tommy K's sticker is significant because the a/stick is also listed as an $80 option! We have thought for years that the optional shifter was this dual gate version, without the 'console'. There are original owner a/t cars with the 'short stick' non-console version of the dual gate shifter, as well as original owner cars with the a/stick version. Over the past few years we've learned that the a/stick is also a dual gate, and we now believe that both versions may have been installed (the short stick version sporadically), and either one cost you an extra $80. We need more info on original a/t cars to be conclusive, but that's where the info is leading us right now.

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

What do you mean by a "short stick" non-console Dual Gate? If it didn't use the plastic Hurst "console" surround, what hid the shifter's guts? The tall "autostick" used a regular 4 speed style "super boot" and was rod activated correct? I've seen this setup in George Lyon's HO A/T Deuce. The Dual Gate was a cable operated shifter, that sits up off the floor and necessitates the use of the plastic "console" to hide it's inner workings. Do I have this straight? I'm just not quite comprehending how a true "Dual Gate" like the ones used in the '69 cars could be installed without a console to cover it's moving parts? Or was the tall stick on the AutoStick shifter a bolt on and was swapped for a shorter stick? I was under the impression the AutoStick shift handle wasn't a removable bolt on type. Marlin, just what the heck are we talking about here? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif

Re: Yenko Optional Twin Sport Mirrors
 

You have it straight, there appears to be a simple stick swap! The short stick stuck onto the a/stick mechanism. The cars with the short stick have a big boot to cover the junk.

Short story, most likely the same shifter, different arms, same price = no optional a/t shifter, just the a/stick which is indeed a dual gate!

I started/stopped typing that reply several times here, so probably got lost in it myself https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif