Idk why anyone is blaming a restoration shop for the hobby getting out of hands it's dealerships buying cars for 40 and selling for 70-80 I get everyone needs to eat but it's ridiculous

My 2 cents but this is another huge factor. In the last six months, I've been priced out of two different purchases when flippers were able to get to them faster than me (obviously being on the other side of the world in Australia doesn't help) only to see them listed weeks later with a minimum 20K markup. Once a car goes up in price and sells at these inflated prices, I've noticed it's much less likely to ever come back down. Rinse and repeat with many cars across the market for a particular make and model and you end up with a hyper-inflated market. Additionally, factor in people looking at these inflated prices when considering selling their car and suddenly you've got a lot of people believing they have something worth more than realistically obtainable and unwilling to move on price... It's been a vicious circle lately...

Good Lord!!! I know this car from back in 2005 before it changed hands several times and several auctions. That’s some coin for a basic 396/325hp. Glad I have mine :)

$97,000

Helps to show the car. Lol

A friend just sent me a picture of a black challenger T/A going for $200K. I got to start watching this on motortrend. crazy.

But what a great color on that 67!

First post said "Prices down and most of no sales the first two days at Kissimmee. I hope this turns around..."

I think your wish came true !!

Jeff

Take a look at the 66/67 SS prices. Insane prices and as we all know. You can’t believe everything you READ when cars are described as REAL etc etc LOL

Thankfully I'm content with what i own ! And I luckily purchased before this huge up swing on Muscle Car price's. My 70 RS Z/28 was purchased in 2010 & my 70 SS Chevelle in 2017. Recently I have had serious cash offers on both cars at more than double my original purchase prices ... That being said , I feel confident in saying that there is No Way i could even come close to replacing either car for what i could of sold them for ? Hard to find anything privately anymore ! Sadly these auctions & all the Muscle Car dealer/ brokers have priced most blue collar Motor Heads out of the market ?!?!

time to adjust insurance policy values.

I’ll chime in on restoration shops, I believe many times the prices seem high because everything is easy from your desk, or your lazy boy. The people complaining have probably never worked with toxic chemicals or done physical labor, they see a part time gardener or ditch digger getting low hourly pay and assume everyone who works with their hands should too.
I personally had isocyanate issues from paint and can’t work with it anymore. (So I know that possible cost) As much as the prices will kill me to pay, when the time comes, I also understand just how much work goes into doing a car correctly. It’s not just the labor, it’s the knowledge , it’s the tools , it’s the storage, it’s the real estate to do it all and it’s the time chasing parts. Even myself I forget just how much time goes into it, because when it’s your own car some of that is already covered because it’s your home or your business expenses your already covering, plus parts chasing is kinda fun (well not for me but for some) a restoration shop has to roll all that cost into each car

That being said I have seen some absolutely outrageous prices (for a regular guy to pay) thrown out by some restoration shops, plus you’d be upside down even in a very valuable car. For some money isn’t an object and that’s where those prices come from the cost to KNOW a guys reputation and know how it’s gonna come out and not be sold or stolen, or in auto body jail is well worth being upside down. Give it a few years the market will catch up anyway, right.

So there’s a little of both out there I guess depends which person you are what category you fall into. The old saying holds true there’s an azz for every seat nothings changed it always has and always will suck for those without the coin for the finer things in life and high end muscle cars have turned into the finer things in life.
I’m just happy I bought mine in the late 80s and early 90s just wish I’d bought all the parts I needed then too. Still glad I raced the heck out of them though.

That’s my .02 cents and it’s probably only worth .01 at best ��

What really amazes me in recent years are the people that pay $300k-$500k or more to have a custom Pro-Touring car built up to that days current fads only to sell it a few years later when those fads have passed for $150k but then complain about a $125k restoration where the value of their car increases every year. I don't get it. I eat a TON of labor on restorations but bill for every minute on a Pro-Touring car with no issues. Go figure!

It went for $220,000 with commission.

It was a neat car. I knew Kenny Papa of Papa's Dodge way back in the early 1980's when he put on a show in Farmington, Connecticut every May. It was THE go-to Mopar show in the region. Everybody would debut their latest over-the-winter restorations at that show. And he had that black on black T/A there every year. I think he owned it since the late 1970's, as well as the blue Superbird. Here's a couple photos of the car from his 1982 show, so he had it for at least 40 years.

The only car that surprised me was how low the 1 of 12 produced, 1971 hemi/automatic Challenger went for. ($115,500 with commission).

Papa's Dodge is still in business in CT to this day.

https://www.mecum.com/auctions/kissi...pa-collection/

thanks for posting that challenger!! what a great car and history. To me, I can see the price as its got the rare color combo, 4 spd, and its a real car. Wont find another easily.

Love the big tires in front!

That is a great comment. Most people don't get the big picture when it comes to preservation OR restoration of the real ones. Doing these cars accurately costs cubic money. And, where are the REAL untouched cars to start with?

So we build a $350K restomod, then in 5 years doesn't it just look like one of the Pro-Street cars on the cover of Hot Rod in 1986? Who likes tweed seats and door panels right now? Will we like a 2022 Resto-Mod 64 Corvette that has been converted to look like a 67, any more 20 years down the road?

My son just turned 4. Every new toy that comes through the shop...first comment from the boy is, "Dad, when can we drive it?"

That's exactly my take, crazy money being spent, when you can spend a million on a car it's chump change!

1969 Daytonna
 

HI heres what 1.3 million gets you .. some one replace the trunk floor ..Can you imagine scraping all that duraguard off.

I will say this on the car prices. First, many of us our out of touch with the people that have lots of funds. If there are people out there that can buy $100K suburbans, is it really a stretch to think there aren't people out there to buy a $100K car they like even if over priced?

I was shocked the other day on a ride from the airport in California, I asked the driver for details on a new suburban I was in. It had the most quiet diesel, super loaded. He said it was 100k or so, maybe over 100K. There is one example.

If a suburban can cost $100K, I see no reason now a killer rare black challenger T/A 4 spd (with restoration costs done right) can go for 200K plus.

I still think that orange L78 camaro that went for 181K is a form of a hunter biden painting on wheels. That one makes no sense.

The black on black T/A Challenger was unrestored. Same condition as when I last saw it 40+ years ago. Not original paint but repainted in the early 1980's most likely. A very cool time capsule.

My old 71 sunroof car went for $550,000. I sold it to Kevin Greene in 1994 for $54,000. That was a good amount back then. (I thought).

918% gain in 29 years, give or take a percentage.


https://www.mecum.com/lots/FL0123-53...er-rt-sunroof/

???

The car was a very low mileage (6,000 miles) example when originally purchased by Otis Chandler for his collection in 1987. It had a crazy custom panel paint job and an L88 fiberglass hood scoop back in the day. No trunk floor was replaced.

And that is what the original, extra cost undercoating looks like when it was factory installed. My 70 Hemi Charger looked just like that. It's like they hired an asphalt repaving crew to apply the stuff with steam roller back then. It was almost 3/8" thick.

I would suggest u do a Google search on the Vin on the challenger. 115k is way to much.

Can you post the VIN? Mecum doesn’t list them.

‘

‘71 Hemi Challenger VIN JS23R1B266605
“Partially re-bodied” as 2010 BJ Auction info as link below = why Mecum also others avoid including Vins?:hmmm:
https://www.barrett-jackson.com/Even...-HARDTOP-88887

:beers:
~ Pete

.

OUCH!

That's an anomaly in his collection I guess. All his other cars were really long term owned originals.

I would say, on a whole, the market is still very strong for these cars and prices up pretty good.

I agree - we may have to consider including that 1969 Yenko "prototype" Camaro in the registry!

I watched several hours of TV coverage yesterday (Friday) and will say it was very refreshing to see mostly true collector cars (or at least what I consider to be collector cars) going across the block, with only a smattering of newer stuff, resto-mods, etc. I will be attending B-J later this month, primarily because it's close to me and my neighbor has free tickets :) , but they seem to have developed a different idea of what constitutes a collector car these days. They certainly have a lot of vehicles that fit my idea of a collector car, but every year there seem to be fewer of them. If B-J thinks they can sell it, it's in their auction, regardless of what it is :(

Another year goes by and more and more fakes sell for big money. Am I the only one that feels nauseated by this?
I honestly don’t know much what to think anymore. People are fully incentivized to lie, cheat, and steal. And many feel the auction houses are just as bad. Plausible deniability is on full display.
Thoughts?

When it comes to the "questionable" cars being sold for big money I think it boils down to a significant number people out there with money to burn that have been getting into muscle cars over the last couple of years. They're not as educated about these cars as they should be and it's leading to foolish decisions like assuming that a car that's been in a magazine or two is what its reported to be at the auction. The auction companies are covered by their disclaimers so they just keep them going across the block as fast as they can sell them without fear if a car or the docs are real or not. Throw a little alcohol in there along with the TV camera's and you've got a perfect storm for a bad decision. I think most of us on this site know better but the poor folks buying those cars don't and they're going to get a expensive wake up call one of these days if they do there homework. But if they didn't do their homework on a car before the auction will they once they get it home? Companies that don't post the VIN aren't doing us any favors either IMO.

YS-8051 sold for $412.5K in 2023 and $407K in 2022

People making a great return on investment are the ones who bought zr1s. Seems dealers sell them to their friends and unload at auction to make over a 100k profit!

"poor folks buying these cars" ... please.

One day one of the well-heeled buyers of an illegitimate car is going to take the seller and the auction house to court and the outcome will be interesting.

High priced classics are a double edged sword. It keeps the next generation out of the game because they can't afford to play. On the other hand it makes restoring old cars and pickups easier because the quality and availability of aftermarket parts.

Orange Camaro is 124379N689832.

Is this a case of EtOH driven price inflation or I am missing something :hmmm:

124379N626283

https://www.mecum.com/lots/FL0123-54...camaro-rs-z28/

Attachment 232245

Nice car, I didn’t see spoilers or hood on the window sticker.

Obviously, that’s why it didn’t bring 400k.

Well, hopefully at $297,000 the documentation cache with two build sheets, POP, window sticker, and delivery check list are all legit


Attachment 232272