Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

I just might bring my '62............ https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/burnout.gif

Put it in whatever class you want to. I'll just be happy to ring it out a bit. It's been quite a few years since I staged that car. I don't care who's alongside me. I'm going to run it to win.

https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/burnout.gif

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

By the way, what's the admission/entry fee?

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

Its regular entry to the track, we do not charge additional for the day. $25.00.

Bring em' down, read the rules if you can and decide where you fit in. Weather forecast looks very good.

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

[ QUOTE ]
I might be wrong on the lift, might have been higher .458/.484 something like that. As I remember they have a pretty big overlap , but used the wide LSA to smooth it out, so they would idle fine

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure what my cam card says, but I keep it in the glove box for these very type of discussions. I simply went to the GM dealer and ordered up the blueprint LT1 cam/lifters. I'm sure other owners could/can get their deuce to idle smooth at 900, but I can't - and therefore I don't think that idle rpm should be used as a barometer to gauge how 'stock' a car is. I think you are saying in a earlier post that the idle quality is not the only test of 'stockness', so then I should be ok. I'm not sure that comparing today's cars to a ronnie sox mag article from 35 years ago is appropriate either, but... that's just me. I think even Ed Hedrick 'may' have had a few bad runs here or there https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

As I type this discussion, I'm realizing what my point is - I hope! Having been to 'stock' events that were put on by different organizations, I have found that the most thorough is the PSMCDR in Stanton - specifically, the Certified Stock class. I plan to build my next deuce within their parameters, and get it Certified through their tear-down process. My concern is that I will bring a legit Certified Stock car to your event, and get deemed a cheater because of rule changes, or different testing procedures, or running too fast, or....???... I would suggest that rather than reinventing the wheel, maybe just piggyback off of their efforts? (maybe not a Certified tear-down process yet, but a similar intrepretation of 'stock').

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

Marlin,
The reason for the rules "changes" are because of JJ and I. Last Nov. the crops were off early, and the weather east looked awsume, so JJ and I each spent a grand each in fuel, hotels and beer and thought we would help the car count at this fairly new event. Besides, Andrew H had been bugging me for years to go down to that track. We had a good idea we would be the quickest, but also knew we would be racing each other all week-end,( best 2 outta 3), so no one should get there panties in a knot.
The week end went well with amazing barometer reading, and everyone was about 3 mph and 3 tenths quicker than normal. Wayne Nelson set a new record in FAST at 10.59 https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/headbang.gif
(He was back last week-end and was stuggling to get high 10's.) Anyways, we had a good time, car went a 11.75 and JJ 11.58 and seemed everything was cool when we started back on our 13 hour return drive.
The next week, we get gangbanged on there message board, so they decide we have to race in FAST next time against overbored, rollerized, punched and stroked cars.
They don't have to worry cause we won't be back. I don't need to drive 26 hours round trip to take that kind of abuse.
So they get some dork to come up with the rule that a car must pull 15 inches of vacuum @ 900 rpm, or automatic FAST class for you. You can take a time machine back to 1969, and you will not get a ZL-1 Camaro or a L88 Vette to pull that kinda #. Actually , it also makes LS6 cars, L72 cars illegal https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif Not up on my Pontiac #'s , but pretty sure a Ram Air 4 would be stuggling to get that reading as well.
I would need to go out and start my Nova, but I think the Nova would have to idle @ 1200 to get close to that number as well. You better check it before you leave Marlin. Good Luck!
Peter

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

This is a very informative and interesting topic for me & I appreciate all who have participated.
Please continue..

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

OHH NO here we go, the persecuted retaliate! relax Pete, I think you got a great car and you and JJ are great guys.

Maybe the stockers around here have never seen those type of ET's from "pure stockers" before. I admit was a bit sceptical myself, having LS6,L88's,LT1's,RAIV's, among many others in my own personal stable as well.

I find the whole conversation amusing though. I live down the block from one of the most revered Icons of this website. In fact I painted some of his creations across the street as I was a painter working in a body shop. I spent time at his house and spoke with him on many, many occassions.

His passion was Pontiacs and Big Block Chevy's. His name was Joel Rosen, maybe you heard of him. Funny thing was back in the day he had this guy who worked for him as a mechanic, his name was Bill Mitchell. Maybe youv'e heard of him. You see these guys could tune a Chevy like nobody else in the country could, and they had their own dyno right here on Sunrise Hwy at their shop known as Motion Performance. Many local track records were held by Joel back in the day with his 427 engines that he transplanted into Camaro's. If you had the funds you could even buy one yourself. These came from Baldwin Chevrolet which was 1 mile away, NOT next door as always erroneously reported here and other places.

Funny thing though, Joel and Bill Mitchell, couldn't seem to get those 427 Camaro's with Headers, Slicks, Tractions Bars, CD Ignitions, and super Dyno Tunes near the times now being reported by ...ahem... "pure stock" cars without the benefit of any aftermarket mods and tires.

Geez such a shame that Bill Mitchell and Joel Rosen couldn't read the Dyno correctly huh??
All they had to do then was take the showroom driven Camaro throw a few stickers on it and blast down the quarter mile on stock tires to 11 seconds. WOW!!! wonder how they missed that??
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Hmmm. there is no doubt todays replacement parts are better,and so are tire compounds. That much better??? I think not.

I don't mind people claiming they are near stock or certified 4 years ago or whatever their story is...I don't care. But if you come down with a car that is heads and shoulders above the rest in performance and seems to be out of the ordinary, then just be prepared to back it up. thats all. Otherwise you and you alone set yourself up for this type of "abuse". Its not anyones elses fault that they are sceptical. Its up to you to prove them wrong. If you don't do that but constantly bad mouth the race or the other competitors...anything to deflect why your car runs as fast as it does, then I say you are not fooling anyone other than yourself. Its a stupid argument.

If you have a near stocker that can pass the test then bring it down and pass it for krissakes. The test is certainly more liberal then a tear down, and takes 10 minutes. By all means shut your critics up..if you have the means to. Who wouldn't want to do that??

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

[ QUOTE ]
I admit was a bit sceptical myself, having LS6,L88's,LT1's,RAIV's, among many others in my own personal stable as well.

[/ QUOTE ]
Perfect! You should go out right now with a vacuum gauge and see what they pull at 900 rpm! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif
Then just to double check, ask Joel what he thinks they should pull.
I am very aware who Motion was and is. There accomplishments are second to none. They were the pioneers in the sport.
It was a different time when the first thing you did was throw on a set of headers and slicks. I doubt Joel ever took a lot of time to try and hook up polyglas tires. Track conditions back then were not what they are today.
Why is it so hard for you to believe that a 3300 lbs ZL1 can go a second quicker than your 4000 LB GTO convertible???? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif
Anyone here with a Moroso power chart????? How much horsepower does it take to make a 3300 lbs car go 115mph????? I've done a little dyno work myself. Matter of fact we did a dyno article on the ZL-1 for Musclcar Enthusiast. We later took the head and intake off for the certified stock class. The camshaft was dead on, cause I too like Marlin, bought it from my GM dealer. So I think i have proved myself lots. I'll be at Martin racing in two week, bring your P&G and your compression tester. It'll pass in it's sleep.
Looking forward to your findings on that vacuum on your "stable L88."
Peter

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

Before this becomes a monkey crap flingin' contest, I think that you, MR. Supergonzo, need to show up in Stanton, MI the 15th and 16th of September and become a believer. Yes, Pete and JJ are at or close the top of the class, but there are some others on had at this meet that are very close. Are you going to call all of them 'cheaters'? In the area of the country I grew up in, you call someone a cheater, you had better be ready to back it up or fight like hell! https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/mad.gif

Re: Factory Stockers Unite!!!
 

I am not calling anyone anything!! I personally have been called alot of names even a couple on this thread. I am sorry I won't respond to stuff like "dork" or any other nonsense, I stopped that in high school. I have been nothing but nice to Pete and JJ. They came down and I appreciate that, I made sure all the photographers made them a high priority. I even had Pete interviewed on camera with one of our awesome Trophy girls, which we had to reshoot a few times because I think Pete stumbled abit talking about his car and looking at this girl at the same time. All completely understandable. Pete and Jim are even on the DVD we produced, I don't know what kind of abuse you are used to but that doesn't sound like abuse to me.
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Its a wonder that the other LS6 cars and 396/375 hp cars didn't have this same problem that day?? You guys all use the same camshaft?

I agree this is getting stupid. Pete and JJ are welcome anytime they wish. You misunderstand my comments. This is not about my RAIV car at all. I don't have to be king of the hill. I think it was very smart of you guys (this might be the last time I compliment you) to build a 427 lightweight BBC. Just like Wayne Nelson did. Its a very tough combination to beat. Almost impossible. I WANT you to prove to the naysayers that your car is legal as you say it is, thats all. This is for your benefit, not mine. I could care less. I am telling you, if you run 1 1/2 seconds ahead of the field that includes similar cars such as your own, your gonna get some flack, whether its my event or not. I am giving you a chance to shut them all up. Either take it or.........forever have doubters.
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Don't talk to me about areas of the Country. I'm from NYC, we don't listen to alot of BS, if you can prove yourself here where EVERYONE is sceptical, then you can make it anywhere. You might have heard a song or two like that.

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Listen I'm done. Pete and JJ I wish you guys well whatever you choose to do, and be safe racing out there, I wish my Camaro ran as well as that one I really do. I'd have a great time with it in F.A.S.T. class