Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

Was this car always known as the first 1967 camaro protoype with it's owners throughout it's life?
...or was it just recently realized?

If the latter,when & who?

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paceme</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This car is historically significant and I appreciate that it's being discussed. I sense this thread is starting to get personal, so lets keep it on topic and informative. </div></div>

X2. Way toooo many extremist nitpicking at everything these days until it turns into a big damn highway or my way fight. Can't we all just enjoy what is left in our life whether it's restored or not? Geeze.

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

It is a pilot car, not a prototype.

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 70 copo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Yet You seem critical...tell me why--I am curious as to the rationale. </div></div>

It's my nature to be skeptical until presented with the facts. Don't get me wrong, I think the car is real. I'm not questioning that at all. I just wonder how much of it is real. The reason given for saving the original trunk floor sounds unrealistic and the trunk lid photos that you posted do not help your position in my opinion. The car looks fantastic; kudos to the owner for getting it done, especially at that cost. But if you're going to put it out there and pump it up with originality, yet not show your work, you need to be prepared for the questions.

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr70</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Was this car always known as the first 1967 camaro protoype with it's owners throughout it's life?
...or was it just recently realized?

If the latter,when &amp; who? </div></div>

Rick,

The car's VIN was ignored until right around the time the car was placed on E-Bay as a race car when that owner fell on hard times and had to sell.

The issue that had clouded the car's complete legitimacy is/was the current internet based working understanding of production sequencing and the application of that theorem to the manufacture of the experimental pilot cars.

For example:

In 2009 when the car was found the following information was posted in the original thread here in this site:

__________________________________________________ _______________________________________________

67L78conv
enthusiast
Registered: 11/25/05
Posts: 310
Loc: NJ USA
09B is actually OK for the early &quot;Pilot&quot; cars that have very very low VINs. Have no idea why but there are several documented pilot cars that have low numbers but the tags are dated 09B with a body number that is far to low for an 09B. For the cars that are known the body number used here along with the date lines up very well. Regular production cars had normal dated tags and what not. Is this car a &quot;Pilot&quot; car? Hard to say for sure with the current information I have but does look pretty good so far.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________________________


The information posted by blogger 67L78Conv is correct - however the continued attempt by a few here to attach a later data based production logic to the build of this car cast a cloud over the car as various individuals attempted to purchase the car at a fire sale price -- while casting disparaging remarks in order to leverage the community in one way or the other.

This is the dark side of social media...but it is what it is. The vast majority of the bad was over at the Team Camaro forum.

The focal point of the fork in the discussion is Pilot car #10. Pilot car 10 is also body 10. Pilot car #10 also has misaligned hidden VIN's stamped into the body and obviously stamped by hand. Notable about the pilot book information on this specific car is the fact that its build information has no hand written changes incorporated into it's build specification and has option content that could have caused GM to make a specific IBM card for it (in May 1966) triggering the 05-B date on the Body plate and a sequence consistent with the Fisher DD10D designation.

With the knowledge of this tag, its Vin and Production order and Date assigned, it would be therefore logical for the research group to weight the data there consistent with a &quot;logical design&quot; of the entire program and thus question the validity of the body plate on VIN#10001 as Kurt did in 2009:

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ______________________________

Kurt S
Pooh-Bah
Registered: 08/01/00
Posts: 1600
Loc: Ann Arbor, MI

I was contacted when this car was originally found.
The cowl tag is out of sequence for the car. There's one other early 67 car like this.
A guess would be they didn't have cowl tags originally and they retrofitted them.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _______________________________

This is as far as I go with this because to go farther opens up a litany of historical disputes that all have origins based in social media conflict where the people on forums are in disagreement on a variety of technical issues.

On one side there is the data and the assumptions based upon that data.

On the other side is the GM documents the surviving cars and the workers who built them.

I was getting ready to reveal this car right over at the Camaro Research Group Site. However several days before I announce the reveal there-- I was banned from that site, consequently I contacted Charley and got advance permission to do the reveal here on Yenko.net

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: L72copocamaro</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 70 copo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Yet You seem critical...tell me why--I am curious as to the rationale. </div></div>

It's my nature to be skeptical until presented with the facts. Don't get me wrong, I think the car is real. I'm not questioning that at all. I just wonder how much of it is real. The reason given for saving the original trunk floor sounds unrealistic and the trunk lid photos that you posted do not help your position in my opinion. The car looks fantastic; kudos to the owner for getting it done, especially at that cost. But if you're going to put it out there and pump it up with originality, yet not show your work, you need to be prepared for the questions. </div></div>

No problem at all... However I am not able to spend vast amounts of time posting Photos. As I said earlier the car was the subject of 2200 individual restoration photographs.

These photographs will be incorporated into planned a rolling exhibit on the car currently scheduled for next year. My recommendation would be to go and see the car while on tour and view the photographs at that time.

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 70 copo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
These photographs will be incorporated into planned a rolling exhibit on the car currently scheduled for next year. My recommendation would be to go and see the car while on tour and view the photographs at that time. </div></div>

Will you be posting a tour schedule?

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

Yes

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

I am pleased to announce that 1967 Camaro VIN 123377N100001 will go on public display at MCACN 2014. The owner has had a mini documentary produced to tell the story of the first production Camaro built.

The documents, the photos,the extensive history and research on this car will be presented as part of the documentary which will be looped on a big screen next to the car.

Re: Camaro History On Display Tomorrow Evening
 

EXCELLENT!!